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Author Topic: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes  (Read 994 times)

Thymouspanis

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Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« on: November 28, 2008, 02:26:35 pm »

The purpose of this suggestion is to make work and combat more interesting by making experience a little less straightforward.

Every creature gets a number (not an attribute) that represents how concentrated they are – the lower it is, the more likely they are to make bigger mistakes or not to notice something. It can only reach some maximum, which might be lowered by fatigue, sobriety, illness, brain damage, or blood loss (at least to the brain). Its rate of change is (or is based on) the focus attribute minus the current amount of distraction, which is caused by the following:

   current activity – working, moving, fighting (specifically attacking and reacting), eating, talking, vomiting etc.

   surprise (would only affect concentration for the instant)

   thought – e.g. grief, fear, excitement – maybe daydreaming in the future

   sensation – pain, bright light, loud noises, bad smells/tastes, heat/cold

   loss of a sense

Generally, the amount distraction one of these things causes depends on personality and is lowered by frequent/extended experience of it, which may be lost (especially experience of things like bright light). What mistakes can be made depend on what is being done. Mistakes while doing nothing or walking might include dropping held items, accidental movement, or falling to the ground, with or without appropriate injuries. Mistakes while working would mostly result in lost progress, but big ones might damage items, even buildings, being used, injure the worker, or start a fire. Any task could be set to take the same amount of actual working time for any dwarf, but novices would have to pause longer and more frequently than experts to regain their concentration or else make mistakes that create more work. How concentrated a dwarf chooses to stay could depend on their patience attribute and/or sense of urgency. Combat mistakes, which I imagine would come primarily from fear, injury (pain and blood loss), fatigue, and inexperience with and/or frequent use of equipment, mostly fall under the category of failing to react wisely or quickly, but might also include dropping, throwing, misfiring, injuring oneself with, or breaking held or worn items, or switching targets. I'm not sure what should happen to someone whose concentration has run completely out, but complete incapacity for voluntary action and loss of sense of the world sound appropriate.

This would allow caftsdwarfship skills to be divided into experience and talent. Talent might be a result of personality and/or attributes, or talent in specific professions might be assigned randomly at birth. A dwarf who has been making clothing for a long time with no natural talent would have learned to bang out a sock a minute without thinking, but would be incapable of producing very high quality clothing. Talent could even be divided into production quality and learning speed.

It would also help make combat more realistic: instead of taking turns inflicting small, ignored wounds that build up, fighters would avoid or block each other's attacks until one of them makes a mistake and the other takes advantage well enough to inflict a substantial wound, which should debilitate its recipient at least for the battle if it's not fatal. Good soldiers would then need experience with the fears, unhappinesses, and pain combat entails in addition to experience with the actions involved. A long list of combinable fears would add realism, but a short, general list or no list at all would work well, I think.
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Draco18s

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2008, 08:03:46 pm »

*Cough*
You know, extreme concentration tends to mean you notice less of the things you aren't concentration on.

The more I look at my computer screen and type the less well I can watch the movie, the more I watch the movie the less I can type.
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Thymouspanis

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2008, 08:36:08 pm »

It's not supposed to represent how concentrated they are on a specific thing, but how much spare mental energy they have to pay attention to what's going on. The more you type, the more concentration you “spend” typing, making you less likely to notice events in the movie. The longer you type without taking small breaks to think about what you're doing, i.e. regain your concentration, the more frequent become your typos and the poorer your use of language. I couldn't think of a perfect word, but I think the model is pretty realistic.
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Refar

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2008, 04:13:19 pm »

Dwarves are dumb enought as they are. I don't think we need/want to artificially increase they dumbness by adding additional annoyance features.
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Thymouspanis

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2008, 05:32:26 pm »

Dwarves are dumb enought as they are. I don't think we need/want to artificially increase they dumbness by adding additional annoyance features.

I'm suggesting a new mechanic, to replace a few that are more abstract, that would make possible some more realistic situations and decisions; I'm not suggesting a change in difficulty — that's a matter of balance, which should be addressed after the mechanics are nailed down.
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qwert

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2008, 05:47:20 pm »

I would much rather do away with the aspect of the current system that lets legendary dwarves not only work OMG fast, but produce masterworks every other job. I propose that we have the option to set a desired quality, and that jobs take time based on the dwarves skill and the item quality. It should probably take a Legendary +5 dwarf about half the time to make a masterwork as a completely unskilled one takes to make a no quality one (debatable). Keep a 'random' setting for how it is now, but incorporate the time aspect.

King comes early? set your skilled carpenter to make a masterwork bed and just wait a lot longer than normal. Need to make 200 cabinets for bedrooms quickly, but don't want to force out your dwarves with masterworks? set your legendary mason to spam no quality cabinets. Find admantine and don't have an armorsmith? have that new peasant toil for a year or two for that masterwork plate.
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Plank of Wood

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2008, 05:54:48 pm »

I would much rather do away with the aspect of the current system that lets legendary dwarves not only work OMG fast, but produce masterworks every other job. I propose that we have the option to set a desired quality, and that jobs take time based on the dwarves skill and the item quality. It should probably take a Legendary +5 dwarf about half the time to make a masterwork as a completely unskilled one takes to make a no quality one (debatable). Keep a 'random' setting for how it is now, but incorporate the time aspect.

King comes early? set your skilled carpenter to make a masterwork bed and just wait a lot longer than normal. Need to make 200 cabinets for bedrooms quickly, but don't want to force out your dwarves with masterworks? set your legendary mason to spam no quality cabinets. Find admantine and don't have an armorsmith? have that new peasant toil for a year or two for that masterwork plate.

Legendary Dwarves are dwarves who have a natural talent for their skill, or spent a huge amount of time training it, masterworks require discipline, vision and talent. If you tell a guy who can't sing to become a singing legend, he's not going to become the next Elvis, no matter how long you train him.
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Thymouspanis

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2008, 06:08:00 pm »

Determining an item's quality by the dwarf's average concentration level throughout production multiplied by natural talent, (so that both talent and experience are required for masterworks) makes room for trading off quality and volume. Being able to influence how the workers do so is definitely a good idea, but a different topic.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2008, 06:09:53 pm by Thymouspanis »
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Draco18s

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2008, 08:39:21 pm »

I'd much rather see a method where when a dwarf gains level in a skill they chose some aspect of that skill to increase, such as doing better work (at the same speed) or doing the same work (faster).
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irmo

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2008, 11:34:50 pm »

I would much rather do away with the aspect of the current system that lets legendary dwarves not only work OMG fast, but produce masterworks every other job. I propose that we have the option to set a desired quality, and that jobs take time based on the dwarves skill and the item quality. It should probably take a Legendary +5 dwarf about half the time to make a masterwork as a completely unskilled one takes to make a no quality one (debatable). Keep a 'random' setting for how it is now, but incorporate the time aspect.

Off topic. Take it out of this thread, please.
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Silverionmox

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Re: Concentration, distraction, and mistakes
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2008, 08:44:07 am »

Need to make 200 cabinets for bedrooms quickly, but don't want to force out your dwarves with masterworks? set your legendary mason to spam no quality cabinets.
That's a signal that the distribution (i.e. the economy) is broken, not the production. Maybe other races could be able to do that, but not dwarves, in any case.. not without tantruming.
Quote from: thymouspanis
I'm suggesting a new mechanic, to replace a few that are more abstract, that would make possible some more realistic situations and decisions; I'm not suggesting a change in difficulty — that's a matter of balance, which should be addressed after the mechanics are nailed down.
Very true.

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