Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Haytrid]

So I do not engage in quantum stockpiling. 

Also, I usually rely on burning wood for charcoal to fuel my furnaces.

I have been trying to think through a different way to store and get the lumber to where I need it.

My question is:

Can I just build a big hole (wood chute) let's say 3x3 straight down and designate the top as a dump site for the wood. 
At the bottom of the chute have maybe a ramp down to an adjoining room that's actually designated as the wood storage.

Will the wood drop down the chute and bleed into the lumber storage?

Would something like this work for stone?

Kind regards,

Haytrid

[PatrikLundell]

The things will fall onto the ramps and stay there. They will also fall onto the dorfs coming to haul them to the stockpile unless you protect them with e.g. a retracting drawbridge (let stuff fall onto it, lock a door to the collection space beneath, open and then close the drawbridge, unlock the door).
It's a lot easier to use a track stop/mine cart to dump things down the chute than using dumping, as you can only have one dump designation active reliably at the same time, and I tend to have other uses for it (you can have multiple dump zones, but no control over what goes where).
It works the same for all goods, wood, stone, glass,...but I don't know what happens with caged critters (they'll probably be unharmed), and dorfs riding mine carts will definitely not be a good idea to send down a chute.

[Loci]

So I do not engage in quantum stockpiling. 

If that's because you don't know how then today is a great day to learn (it's not hard). If that's for moral reasons then avoiding "quantum stockpiling" will require a more complex minecart setup.

Can I just build a big hole (wood chute) let's say 3x3 straight down ...

Yes, but 1x1 is sufficient. Since you cannot reliably dig a 1x1 chute in the more recent versions, you can use an up/down stairway instead (just channel out the top tile).

... and designate the top as a dump site for the wood.

You cannot specify the type of dumping; all garbage dump zones are "general use". You could use a dumping minecart in a standard "quantum stockpile" setup to dump only logs down the chute.

At the bottom of the chute have maybe a ramp down to an adjoining room that's actually designated as the wood storage.

Will the wood drop down the chute and bleed into the lumber storage?

The dumped logs will all stack ("quantum stockpile") in the bottom of the chute. If you used a garbage dump zone then the logs will be forbidden (requiring a manual unforbid before use).

Your dwarves, however, are likely to bleed when brained by falling logs. You could add a lever-controlled hatch cover in the chute to delay the final drop until your dwarves are clear of the area, or drop the wood in a minecart which automatically dumps at a track stop at the bottom of the chute (another "quantum stockpile"). 

To avoid all "quantum stockpiling", you'd need to setup a stockpile topside giving to a minecart. The minecart travels down to the bottom of the chute (by tracks or falling) to a non-dumping track stop set to give to a subterranean wood stockpile. Dwarves will then unload the logs and return the minecart topside (by hauling unless you have connected tracks) for the next load.

Would something like this work for stone?

Yes.

[Haytrid]

I prefer not to use quantum stockpiles simply because I like to learn the intricacies and nuances of the game.  It forces me to think my way around the problem and better learn the game.

So let's say I set a minecart stop at the top to dump down the chute instead of designating a dump.  I haven't messed with minecarts but it sounds like it's about time for me!

So at the bottom of the "chute" if I build a series of downramps going into an adjoining room or a big open space in the wall the logs won't simply "topple" into the room?  I wasn't planning on setting the exact bottom of the chute as the collection point, I really pictured the logs just kind of rolling into the next room down a ramp but actually they will just keep stacking up on the ramps?

Regards,

Haytrid

[burrito25man]

I prefer not to use quantum stockpiles simply because I like to learn the intricacies and nuances of the game.  It forces me to think my way around the problem and better learn the game.

So let's say I set a minecart stop at the top to dump down the chute instead of designating a dump.  I haven't messed with minecarts but it sounds like it's about time for me!

So at the bottom of the "chute" if I build a series of downramps going into an adjoining room or a big open space in the wall the logs won't simply "topple" into the room?  I wasn't planning on setting the exact bottom of the chute as the collection point, I really pictured the logs just kind of rolling into the next room down a ramp but actually they will just keep stacking up on the ramps?

Regards,

Haytrid

unfortunately the logs will stay put wherever they are dropped. There is no "rolling" from one tile to another laterally, except for a for particular situations (fligging with bridges for example). That said, you can easily have a minecart take wood from a stockpile on the surface, and have a dwarf walk the minecart to your wood stockpile below and deload it. Your dwarf will wilk it back up when he's done.

[Merlota]

I almost always have a 1x1 drop chute from top to bottom on a map.  It is usually used for stone and ore.  To stop dwarves from being crushed there is a retracting bridge 1 level above the bottom and door to the landing zone.  Lock the door, pull the lever, pull again, unlock door. 

[Dracko81]

While reading this thread I had an idea of how to make it do what you want.  That doesn't require doing anything after setting it up.

Note this might create a slight FPS drain if the system is made too big also.

!!Science!!

Created a surface cart track to dump logs down the hole.  Created a 1x1 chute down 5 levels.  Dug a tunnel to an aquifer, water drained into the river through floor grates.  The chute empties into the path of the flowing aquifer.  The water flow pushes the logs onto the grates to be collected.

This was simply a proof of concept and 2 deep water was pushing the logs along fine.  The following set up could then be used at lower levels without aquifer or drain.

A simple short pathed 2 level design should work for deeper down like this.  This one was set up using buckets and 2 ponds.



Unfortunately there is not enough pressure in this design to push stone.  It was quite capable of pushing logs onto the grate and very occasionally past it.  Should do fine for what you want.

I'm sure someone else can design something better.

[Haytrid]

Thank you all for the advice.  I think I can handle the retracting bridge at the bottom to a drop zone and I feel I am competent enough to immediately implement that.

I do like !!Science!! though, and I have been meaning to do more with water-works.  I struggle to interpret the cool pictures you guys put together though.  I feel like I have a far too. . . . two dimensional view of the game and begin struggling with multi z-levels more complex than a stairs or a ramp.  I'm getting there!

So am I interpreting this picture correctly?  Where do the lower (right) channels line up with the top (left) picture?

[Dracko81]

Collection area is correct, the 1x1 chute you marked was on of my pitting areas, since dropping water 1 at a time takes a long time.

The pic on the left is the top and the one on the right is below it.

The logs actually drop where the stone is in the picture, but arrows show the water flow correctly.  I have an idea to make it work with stone though, I need to do some more testing.

On the second image the water falls from above into the far top left and then collects into the reservoir, need enough water to have the system work, without enough water down the bottom the system might stall, resulting in logs hitting heads.

[Dracko81]

If you set up a screw pump directly next to the chute, it will push stone onto the grates without too much issue.  The only problem then is that isn't powerful enough to push metals, I dropped a tetrahedrite down and it won't move.



That set up is actually pushing stone(260 weight) onto the top 3 grates.  Tetrahedrite is 490 weight so not sure what the limit is for water pushing items.

[Montieth]

Standard detail of my forts.

I place a wood collection stockpile outside the fort, but inside the upper boundary where walls will eventually be. Theres a cart with a "push on full" order which travels down a length of track i to the hillside my fort is under and that runs to a track stop set for dumping down a 1x1 chute(no braking). The track path is shaped like a p with the cart returning to the start point. Usually around 4-5 levels down is the wood storage area which is 1 level down from my carpentry area and wood furnaces. Usually 2 levels down from the surface I add a sliding gate to provide security in the event of attack. The wood storage area is usually a 3x3 area with the wood landing at say the left and the stairs up to the carpentry area at the right. Dwarves tend not to stand under the chute when grabbing wood and instead stand just to the left. I have not had issues with dropping wood injuring a dwarf for quite some time. Oh, an added layer of security is a hatch to lock that covers the stairs down to the wood pile.

The way it works is haulers assigned wood collection put wood in the stockpile above and then load the mine cart. Its pushed when full, enters the hillside, dumps and basd on the route of the tracks returns to its start point and halts due to another track stop with max braking. The  wood pile is set to supply th carpentry workshop, a bowyery and a crafshop just for wood working tasks. Thers also usually two wood furnaces. I now add an additional wood storage area for a carpenters shop designated fpr my best carpenter which inky draws willow and featherwood so that the master carpenter can make shields which are  both light and of high quality. 

Is setup minimizes trips indoors, gets the wood down deep into the fort, helps sort it and minimizes workload for effect. Theres also very little chance for dwarfs to be hit by the mine cart if you minimize its outdoor path length. Theres no reason to go into the Path for the dump area and as Isaid, they tend not to get hit by dropping wood.

[Sutremaine]

Outdoor track can be made safer by adding a track stop near the pushing-off point.