Hello, to those who are not quite aware (and this fact is easy to confirm mundanely without explicit testing) there are prerequisites in which any settlement with a 'market' (shown as a core capital province like a fortress or a town, that in world-gen can accommodate nobles exclusively) contributes towards the items that can be traded via a trade network, and that hill dwarves (as to say mountain halls and hillocks) contribute the resources that they settle on by running it though this market.
- To demonstrate the relationship between each individual market and its local hillocks, ask villagers about where they trade, they will usually mention the closes fortress/civ central province in range or multiples. Hillock supplies also contribute to support this also as they directly link in as stated.
If you destroy your 'market towns' and your civilisation goes extinct for a lack of a landholder to rule a fortress to fill their population requirement (pushed forward by excess dwarves and refugees in hillocks and the world), the amount of goods usually available to you is severely decreased. However, player fortresses qualify as markets also count as marketplaces for hillocks to trade with with hillock sites forming close by locally.
- Dark fortresses without ruler demons are indicated as greyed out goblin entity controlled fortresses often spring up in areas dense with dark pits to fufill proximity when dark pits branch away or the player intervenes, goblin populations grow quicker so this is more visible, when trade is enabled for goblins as a playable civ (via a only as invasive as needs be amount of modding) trade links form since the old trade links to the capital become either too numerous or too far away.
From what i am aware of there is very little written down or recorded of these systems even on the wiki, the community is probably aware on a individual level in different scales, but overall no solid tracked down information so far.
One theory is that it was a *forgotten* changelog entry on -
the world activation 0.40.01 patch two years ago wheras my other theory is that it may pretty much stem from the primordial days or as a forgotten about detail on the changelog for the economy and caravans update a long time ago.
The collection of key points i am putting foward are> Resource availibility
> Preset?
> Can it be willingly manipulated?
- Are embark goods determined pre-meditatively regardless of fortress progress/industry (certain amounts of evidence pointing towards the case) or can they be determined when a site is retired also?
- In relation to the point above, are site resources counted on part of what is already availible (local trees etc) or by the stockpiles where they are stored with reasonable exceptions like inaccessible
> Pre-generated dwarf fortress sites have a large array and quantity of goods place in and around the site, it would make sense that these 'loot piles' both within and on the depot if it was a stockpile based would contribute to the embark screen. However in another lapse of logic, because these are spontaneous, and likely determined by the entity tokens it would also support that it is pre-meditated and it is programmed beforehand to fill the 'stockpiles' up based off the template of goods read from the entity and the small 4x4 (or was it 3x3?) embark that the 'Home' fortress site is located upon.
- This is similar to dark fortress sites, which with modding can accommodate trade, in which the goblin tower will accrue their [:COMMON] weapons into a communal site armory room, however attacks on dwarf fortress home sites after a reclaim also show that dwarves take items from dead invaders but because they lack the tags, they do not sell them via the loot checklist of the carvans
- Only sites with structual entrances to the underground or retired fortresses that have pierced the underground subterreanean layers are egible to trade certain goods, dark fortresses have pits that allow them to recruit trolls from a subterreanean habitat bypassing restrictions that are imposed on other animals like camels who are restricted to the badlands/desert before being embarkable.
> Very 'out there most unlikely' question on exotic animal trading, though i've heard it historically denied. Once the method of choosing goods has been narrowed down (for examples sake lets say its a mixture of already stockpiled goods and trading) could a creature trained up to a domesticated level, with relevant equal (in hindsight the common_domestic token is rigid, but in practical theory if it was loosened up the said scenario could happen) civilisation familiarity and training level through multiple caravan visits to my fortress eventually sell and embark with the animals i have collected and stored for embark use appropriately? (like i mentioned for the purposes of example, to say that i sold/tributed a margin of my domesticated animals and put a minimum amount of them into 'animals' storage cages, by building and deconstructing cages to trap them before retiring my fortress.)
The reason i ask about this question is because once upon a time, i was embarking with a dead civilisation, with virtually no materials (there might have been a hillock supplying some local wood, i cant remember exactly and this was when substitute training axes could chop so wood was all that was required) and all the non-biome specific common creatures were availible, long story short my civ was in a very bad state and only had enough animals to send pack donkeys. Naturally i sold them my yaks and the next year the yaks i sold them reappeared as pair of caravan pullers, leading to a sudden explosion of every caravan coming after that being lines and lines of yaks (the circumstance that i supplied exactly 2 sexually compatible opposite gender yaks, enough to raise suspicion, but also that from my resident grazing yak herd, i also experienced a yaksplosion myself personally from the recieving end of the trading yaks, leading to me suspecting that the yaks i had pastured around my trade depot were breeding with the female wagon puller yaks & starter female yak/their offspring *I know it was fertile because it had already birthed a calf before i sold it on account of it getting old and the most valuable thing i had* & subsequent yaks to give birth off site in the source market premises)
- Its known that animals do give birth offsite, contributing to localised region populations, it would make sense that since the caravan & merchants are broadly connected to the civ and living entity members that while the economy might not save every hard copy of a object besides on a list, animal entities leaving with the group do contribute to local site population
There was some
discussion here (i was a newcomer to the forum and not familiar with the game then) in which i raised my finding, later quietust PM'd me to tell the now slightly embarrassing mistake id made in my post and tell me that trading animals does not have that effect. Least to say after seeing what I believe in it happening before my very eyes I don't particularly believe him, just showing that knowledge about the background functions of market economics is extremely lacking even amongst the very knowledgeable. Science was needed but such exact circumstances are hard to replicate so nothing has been done to that scale by myself since.
Technical input to these questions would be greatly appreciated.
Author
Topic: Determining embark starting supplies. (Read 786 times)