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[Moogie]

I'm trying to gen a uniformly cold world, but even with Variation at 3200 and min/max Temperature ranges of 10-25, I still get glaciers along only the top or bottom edge of the world. All it's doing is making the strip of coldness comparitively wider, rather than spreading it out across the whole map.

Am I misunderstanding Variation, or is this a bug?

[Untelligent]

Yeah, it's always cold on one side of the map and hot on the other. The temperature settings in worldgen settings are applied after that, and they don't make a huge difference compared to the latitude thing. You might be able to get bigger differences if you edit the worldgen param file directly, which lets you set numbers outside the usual ranges.

[JoeJoe]

• There is always a general north-south temperature gradient.
• The randomly generated temperature only "slightly" modifies this baseline value.
• Note that valid parameter settings are from -1000 to 1000. Even with a max temperature of -10 I got a small corner without glaciers in my world.
• The variance parameter just influences how high the temperature gradient (in the randomly generated stuff) can get. With very low values you will only have a couple points with the maximum and minimum respectively and the values in between these points will be relatively smoothed out. With very high values you will have very many maxima and minima, that are much closer to each other. Since there is a general temperature gradient anyway changing the temperature variance doesn't have much of a visible effect, unless at the very extreme points.

Setting minimum and maximum temperature to -100 created only glaciers for me. Note that "cold" can also include tundra and forests.

Edit re what Untelligent said: Editing the world_gen.txt directly doesn't make a difference. If you set the values outside the acceptable ranges DF just takes the maximum value for that parameter. As I pointed out, you can set the values up to -1000, also in DF, no problem.

[Urist Da Vinci]

Fun worldgen temperature facts (that you won't find on the wiki) (FROM 0.34.11, NOT VERIFIED YET FOR 0.40.xx):

- If you gen an area with [TEMPERATURE:0:0:0:0] i.e. max, min, and both variances are zero, you can see how latitude, elevation, and rainfall affect the temperatures.
- Temperature is strongly affected by latitude, and to a lesser degree the other factors including the random variances introduced by the player (unless you enter absurdly large max or min numbers).
- The difference between winter and summer temperatures is zero at the top and bottom of the map, and linearly grows to a peak of about 30 U (40 W) difference in the central temperate zones.
- The normal temperature is the seaside summer temperature. Elevation or time of year (in temperate areas) subtracts from this temperature.
- High rainfall (over 66) can reduce a scorching/hot area to hot or warm.
- The elevation and rainfall changes happen during worldgen and are reflected in the exported temperature map. The exported temperature map shows the summer temperatures for temperate areas.
- The maximum temperature worldwide is capped at the worldgen max+25 (in W units). No such logic exists for minimum temperatures. While this was probably implemented to solve the fat-melting bug, it can also be used to enforce a global freezing.

Worldgen_temperature * 0.75 + 10000 = degrees Urist

In worldgen units:

Code: [Select]

-0    freezing
0-15  cold
15-50 temperate
50-75 warm
75-90 hot
90+   scorching


[cephalo]

Temperature is very hard to control. That's why I left the temperature map out of PerfectWorldDF. Everything was mostly overwritten by other procedures that we don't have access to in world gen. The bug fixes for temperature issues kind of took control away from the players I guess.

[i2amroy]

Just for anyone who doesn't know already I figured I'd outline exactly how the world gen temperature settings work.
1) The game generates a temperature gradient based off the max and min temperature settings (it's a bit fuzzy, as pointed out before). This gradient either goes from north to south or vice versa.
2) The game generates a "noise" setting of individual +'s or -'s based off the X/Y values.
3) The game generates a +/- based off of any grid weighted values.

To pick the actual temperature of the a location, the game then adds up all 3 values to get the result as the final temperature. Thus increasing all increasing X/Y settings does is increase/decrease the "noise" temperature values, without actually changing the base temperature values beneath it all.

[JoeJoe]

Fun worldgen temperature facts...

Any specific reason this isn't on the wiki? Would it be considered too detailed? At least a link to the forum would be nice.

Another question: Does the high rainfall actually affect the ingame temperature map or does it only change what is shown in the game on the embark screen?

Just for anyone who doesn't know already I figured I'd outline exactly how the world gen temperature settings work.
1) The game generates a temperature gradient based off the max and min temperature settings (it's a bit fuzzy, as pointed out before). This gradient either goes from north to south or vice versa.
2) The game generates a "noise" setting of individual +'s or -'s based off the X/Y values.
3) The game generates a +/- based off of any grid weighted values.

[unnecessary nitpick]
The grid weighted values are generated before the noise based off the x/y variance is added. Also, based on what Urist Da Vinci said, I would think that the baseline temperature gradient is not affected by the min and max values.
[/unnecessary nitpick]

[i2amroy]

The baseline is affected by max temperatures, it's just that the boundaries are a little fuzzy. It's why by altering it you can make an ice world or a scorching desert world (though you will need to mess with the desired count values to get it to actually accept it).

[JoeJoe]

Hmm, I'm not fully convinced. I might do some testing eventually.