Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Sutremaine]

I did 42 runs with a dwarf who had a lot of injuries, and found out some interesting things.

The first 14 runs were done with a hospital with access to the following: thread, cloth, soap, splints, and a traction bench. Overall, the dwarf died 8 times and recovered 6 times. Data for these runs is rather patchy and inconsistently taken.
The second 14 runs added water washing, applied via bucket brigade. Overall, the dwarf died 8 times and recovered 6 times.
The last 14 runs added a table for surgery. Overall, the dwarf died 6 times and recovered 8 times.

Dwarf injuries, 18th Obsidian
Red: Right Upper Arm, Left Lower Arm, Right Hand, Left Hand, Right Upper Leg, Left Upper Leg, Right Lower Leg, Left Lower Leg, Right Lung, Left Elbow, Right True Ribs.
Yellow: Upper Body
Brown: Left Cheek

Max blood count: 4440
Blood lost or gained per day: 70
Lowest blood count: 30

Blood count changed at approximately 4am, not as the day started. Some of the dates are wrong, but a few of them being one day out doesn't bother me. All dates are as originally recorded, and infection counts are all for 1st Felsite.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

------------------
First set:
Not washed:
16th Felsite, died, 7 infections
16th Felsite, died, ? infections
Washed, died:
23rd Felsite, 5 infections
16th Felsite, 5 infections
23rd Felsite, 6 infections
2nd Hematite, 7 infections
16th Felsite, 7 infections
23rd Felsite, 7 infections
Washed, survived (dates denote first observed blood recovery):
3rd Hematite, 170 blood, 5 infections
15th Felsite, 1010 blood, 4 infections
23rd Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections
23rd Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections
23rd Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections
16th Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections

------------------
Second set (bucket brigade):
Not washed:
16th Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections
16th Felsite, died, 5 infections
Washed, died:
16th Felsite, 4 infections
2nd Hematite, 4 infections
16th Felsite, 4 infections
16th Felsite, 7 infections
2nd Hematite, 6 infections
23rd Felsite, 7 infections
23rd Felsite, 6 infections
Washed, survived (dates denote first observed blood recovery):
1st Felsite, 2970 blood, 3 infections
23rd Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections
16th Felsite, 1080 blood, 4 infections
1st Felsite, 2970 blood, 3 infections
23rd Felsite, 100 blood, 4 infections

------------------
Third set (bucket brigade + surgery table):
Not washed:
16th Felsite, died, 7 infections
16th Felsite, died, 5 infections
23rd Felsite, died, 5 infections
16th Felsite, died, 6 infections
Washed, died:
23rd Felsite, 5 infections
23rd Felsite, 5 infections
Washed, survived (dates denote first observed blood recovery):
1st Hematite, 1990 blood, 4 infections
1st Hematite, 1500 blood, 4 infections
No blood loss. 1 infection
No blood loss. 1 infection
1st Slate, 3950, 3 infections
20th Felsite, 1850 blood, 4 infections
18th Felsite, 1710 blood, 4 infections
4th Hematite, 730 blood, 5 infections

Survival rates by number of infections:
1 infection ---------- 2/2
2 infections --------- NA
3 infections --------- 3/3
4 infections --------- 13/16
5 infections --------- 2/9
6 infections --------- 0/4
7 infections --------- 0/7

I'm not sure if the next batch of statistics is really helpful, but I'll throw it in anyway.
Survival rate by washing:
No soap, no bucket -- 0/2
No soap, bucket ----- 1/6
Soap, no bucket ----- 6/12
Soap, bucket -------- 16/22

Other observations:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1. One test saw the dwarf being brought to her room. I deconstructed the bed. Instead of being taken to the hospital, she was left on the floor, being fed and watered but otherwise ignored. By the 8th of Granite, she had 8 infections, and I topped up her blood to 500000 once it reached 30. At the beginning of Galena (Late Summer) she was finally taken to the hospital and treated. Blood count reached 487241 and then stabilised.

The infections went away as the injuries healed, although the left elbow read as infected despite having no wounds present.

2. Since I never bothered removing the offending mining designation, I occasionally had other dwarves to study. One of them had 7020 blood to the test dwarf's 4440, and his blood loss was 110 a day.

------------------
So, what can we draw from this?

1. Bucket brigades (or a loop of screw pumps) might or might not be useful. They may interfere with diagnosis, with the diagnostician reading a water-covered dwarf as clean when they really should be getting a nice soapy bath. If the water can be applied after soaping, it might or might not help. Further testing required.
2. Blood loss and blood gain happen at the same rate for the same dwarf.
3. Changes in blood level are decided about once a week, starting at the 1st of every month.
4. Infections can appear at any time. Data not provided in this post shows that they can occur after suturing. Whether they can occur after dressing is unknown. Further observation required.
5. Changes in blood level appear to be percentage based.
Test dwarf: 70/4440 a day = 1.576...% a day.
Other dwarf: 110/7020 a day = 1.566951...% a day.
Further observation required, however, as there are only two data points for this.
6. Tables are really, really useful for mangled dwarves.
7. Not within the scope of this, as testing was cut short as soon as an increase in blood count was observed, but dwarves may or may not be able to relapse once they start to recover.

Based on #3 and #5, each dwarf has at least ten rolls of the die before they die. A dwarf who is Faint has already failed five of them, and a dwarf who is Pale has failed seven.

[smjjames]

Reminds me of this miner that I had in this fort which, along with another miner, fell to the bottom of the main stairwell, landed on top of the first (now dead) miner and managed to survive with a great many bone breaks and ended up with many (or all?) wounds infected Didn't have any soap at the time, but I don't think soap and water alone would have saved him, the miner would have needed modern antibiotics. He fought on for a bit and then succumbed.

Also, the wiki specifically says that tables are required for the surgery bit, though I've seen dwarves do surgery where the patient is resting.

[wooks]

I wonder if you could mod the raws to make a liquid like gnomeblight help cure infections? It would be needlessly complicated to apply, but interesting none the less.

[Sutremaine]

Where's it say in the wiki that tables are required? I checked under Surgeon, Table, and Healthcare, and didn't find anything.

There's no way of curing infections directly, I think, but you could create a syndrome that boosts an affected creature's Recuperation and then find some way of applying it. I'm not sure how the HAS_BLOOD token interacts with syndromes. NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT might allow a creature to get up and soap themselves even if every bone in their body is broken, but I don't know if post-infection cleansing helps any.

[XXSockXX]

Where's it say in the wiki that tables are required? I checked under Surgeon, Table, and Healthcare, and didn't find anything.

In the "Setting up a Hospital" section of the Healthcare article:

Build at least one table (b-t) for surgeons to perform surgery on. You may perform surgery without tables; it will be more messy.

    Place the tables right next to the beds, or you may get "cancels surgery, patient not resting" spam, as moving the sleeping patient more than one square from the bed to the table wakes up the patient. Bug:2773
    Multiple dwarves may undergo simultaneous surgeries on the same table.

I build a table next to every bed in the hospital and I think I got that from the wiki. Seems to work for me.

Doesn't really say they are required for surgery though, right.

[PaleBlueHammer]

Not sure if I glossed over it or not; was the water *clean*?  It may not make a difference at this level, but I always try to plop a well down in the hospital with pumped water beneath it (or a cistern).

[Sutremaine]

Clean water, yes, taken from a source two levels deep.