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[DuckThatQuacks]

This looks interesting. I'd like a turn if/when it get's started.

[Larix]

Hmm, wouldn't you have to pick up a pretty run-down fort with unhappy dwarfs every spring? I can't imagine them coming out of a year of fending for themselves in too great shape - likely gone sober for half a year, with no new clothes and only one or two types of food.

The biggest potential problem is the seed limit - it works embark-wide: if e.g. the 'other' fort has 200 pig tail seeds and no standing orders to plant them, your half of the fort will have zero seeds and no way to get any new ones apart from the autumn caravan - when it's too late to plant them.

The manager's job orders are split among all appropriate workshops on the entire embark; it may happen that the non-active fort ends up producing some items, or blocking a bunch of jobs for a long time, because the orders get sent to their workshops repeatedly. Landed nobles cannot be replaced, so if the other half of the fort has the baron's residence, you cannot talk with diplomats (and the other half will have to deal with the two leftover diplomats from last year). Finally, trade depots are notoriously tricky - if you have two active ones on the same embark, they can completely screw up caravans. I think that some automatically-assigned jobs like butchery as well as hauling occasionally get assigned to workshops or dwarfs who have no path to the job items, but i'm not too sure. If that was really what happened, it only slowed down the execution of jobs and didn't block them totally.

Depot and workshop problems can be avoided if overseers are required to 'f'orbid workshops and buildings that could cause problems (and you could do it yourself if the last overseer forgot).

Edit: i don't mean to discourage you, just trying to point out some problems that might need adressing in the rules before you start.

[Meph]

You can just leave dwarves alone for a year and they will be perfectly happy, all they were doing is eating, drinking and making friends. Granted that you stockpile enough food and drink of course. I like the idea itself, but the start will be difficult.

One thing to do is designate a massive area to dig, and set a lot of jobs on repeat for a year, maybe using workflow/autolabor on your fortress-side, to keep them going while the other fort is playing. Or set everyone up for military training/pump-operating, a full year works wonderns.

I think it would be best to dig a nice layout, make some rooms and bridges for the airlock, and then abandon, reclaim, than start with these two forts already set up a little.

[CognitiveDissonance]

You can just leave dwarves alone for a year and they will be perfectly happy, all they were doing is eating, drinking and making friends. Granted that you stockpile enough food and drink of course. I like the idea itself, but the start will be difficult.

One thing to do is designate a massive area to dig, and set a lot of jobs on repeat for a year, maybe using workflow/autolabor on your fortress-side, to keep them going while the other fort is playing. Or set everyone up for military training/pump-operating, a full year works wonderns.

I think it would be best to dig a nice layout, make some rooms and bridges for the airlock, and then abandon, reclaim, than start with these two forts already set up a little.

That is actually a great idea! I was going to try and squeeze that into the first year, but abandon/reclaim sounds better.

And in response to

[useful advice]

I was going to address that with a wall or locked underground, with a central trading depot. Dwarves won't use seeds or butcher creatures they cannot possibly path to. But I haven't considered managerial designation... we may have to do without a manager, or even have centralized workshops.

Nobles will be a communal responsibility


I was going to set things up last night, but I ended up asleep for 13 hours. Daylight savings is harsh With the new advice though, I should easily have it up for tomorrow morning!

[Ruhn]

Ha!  That would be fun to totally disregard noble mandates since he lives in the other fort.  Let them deal with the backlash.

ideas:
1- Start+Abandon a fort would fix the seeds problem Larix pointed out.  When abandoning, maybe hide a lever outside the fort and wall it off after locking the drawbridge?
2- Doing Red and Blue forts would have name recognition thx to halo videos, but we have other colors to pick from also.

A possible story could be group A starts a fort, decides this place is a terrible spot and leaves.  Group B sees fort of group A and decides they can make it work, starting fort.  Then group A hears that B started a fort, and decide to lay claim to that location again.  Hot, Swampy, or Cold loctions could support the story.

possible problems:
1- How will the 2nd fort (the abandoned one) get populated?  If migrants come late in year 2, or too few, they may all die.
2- Telling people apart between forts will make using Therapist and managing military more FUN.  (custom job titles for all?!)

[joeclark77]

I have an idea for separating migrant waves; don't separate them at all.

All migrants go to whichever fort is currently being managed. Migrants arrive in Fort 1s year, they all go to Fort 1, Fort 2 is left alone. This way, the unmanaged fort won't have to worry about overpopulation or supply shortage, and it will make micromanaging easier.

Seems like the obvious way to make this work is to have each fort sealable and completely self-sufficient, so that at the end of a player's turn he closes all the drawbridges and nothing can get in or out.  That way dwarves will not have to be micro-managed.  Migrants will go to whichever fort is open.  Caravans will go to whichever fort is open.  The fort that is closed needs to be able to work on auto-pilot.

[CognitiveDissonance]

Okay, this weekend was my 5 year anniversary with The Girlfriend, so stuff didn't happen then. In retrospect, I'm glad due to the planning issue Ruhn pointed out.
Today should be good. I have a backstory ready, and just need to prepare the map+rules+post. Will try for it tonight.

Ha!  That would be fun to totally disregard noble mandates since he lives in the other fort.  Let them deal with the backlash.

ideas:
1- Start+Abandon a fort would fix the seeds problem Larix pointed out.  When abandoning, maybe hide a lever outside the fort and wall it off after locking the drawbridge?
2- Doing Red and Blue forts would have name recognition thx to halo videos, but we have other colors to pick from also.

A possible story could be group A starts a fort, decides this place is a terrible spot and leaves.  Group B sees fort of group A and decides they can make it work, starting fort.  Then group A hears that B started a fort, and decide to lay claim to that location again.  Hot, Swampy, or Cold loctions could support the story.

possible problems:
1- How will the 2nd fort (the abandoned one) get populated?  If migrants come late in year 2, or too few, they may all die.
2- Telling people apart between forts will make using Therapist and managing military more FUN.  (custom job titles for all?!)

Hmm, I'm glad you mentioned the migrant issue. I might designate the first migrant wave to be directed to fort 2, and prepare it with some food/booze to start off. How does the post-abandon scatter work?

Alternatively, I may simply play for the first year and prepare the absolute bare minimum concent for survival.

Custom Job Title is a good idea, I'll put that into the rules if people would like it.

I have an idea for separating migrant waves; don't separate them at all.

All migrants go to whichever fort is currently being managed. Migrants arrive in Fort 1s year, they all go to Fort 1, Fort 2 is left alone. This way, the unmanaged fort won't have to worry about overpopulation or supply shortage, and it will make micromanaging easier.

Seems like the obvious way to make this work is to have each fort sealable and completely self-sufficient, so that at the end of a player's turn he closes all the drawbridges and nothing can get in or out.  That way dwarves will not have to be micro-managed.  Migrants will go to whichever fort is open.  Caravans will go to whichever fort is open.  The fort that is closed needs to be able to work on auto-pilot.

That sounds right, but I'm concerned with the merchants bugging out if there is more than one trade depot. A centralized trade depot sounds more mechanically reasonable. Would also force people to trade, and manage goods, properly.

[Ruhn]

I noticed this weekend that food might rot when not in the food stockpile, even if in barrel.  This would mean we can't stockpile food (& booze?) in the abandoned fort.  Some players can survive just on a pick & plump helmate, so maybe we don't worry about setting aside food.  Depending on the embark, fort #2 migrants can gather plants (above or in caverns) to survive until a caravan comes.  A well would improve their chances also.

Can anyone provide !!SCIENCE!! on how the scatter works?  If we wall some picks and axes (or valueable trade goods) into a room, will they stay there?

[CognitiveDissonance]

I noticed this weekend that food might rot when not in the food stockpile, even if in barrel.  This would mean we can't stockpile food (& booze?) in the abandoned fort.  Some players can survive just on a pick & plump helmate, so maybe we don't worry about setting aside food.  Depending on the embark, fort #2 migrants can gather plants (above or in caverns) to survive until a caravan comes.  A well would improve their chances also.

Can anyone provide !!SCIENCE!! on how the scatter works?  If we wall some picks and axes (or valueable trade goods) into a room, will they stay there?

I haven't seen food rot happen whatsoever to properly stored food. Are you sure you didn't have a serious vermin problem?

Looked it up... quote from wiki:

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Miasma#Food_rot
Food rot

Prepared food will rot the same as meat, plants, cheese, eggs, and prepared fish, though plants will wither instead of producing miasma. The only places where food will not rot are in a stockpile, in a trade depot, in the embark wagon, when used as a reaction component, or while being carried by a dwarf, caravan pack animal, or wagon. Additionally, eggs will not rot in a nest box. It does not matter if the food is in a container; a barrel or pot full of meat left in a corridor will eventually rot.
 
While you'd expect milk, fat, and tallow to rot, it seems that they do not. Nor do any of the other categories of food, including flours, drinks, seeds, and rock nut paste. A raw fish will rot no matter where it is stored, which is why it's important to prepare fish as quickly as possible

[Ruhn]

Oh cool, guess I shouldn't have been so lazy.  Flour+Booze+Seeds should work just fine.

[CognitiveDissonance]

Hey all, the fort is up and running! Link:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=124086.0

[Timeless Bob]

I'm surprised you don't just embark on either side of an impassable water channel.

[CognitiveDissonance]

I'm surprised you don't just embark on either side of an impassable water channel.

As a matter of fact, I did! Check the embark map.
The catch is that migrants/merchants could arrive from either side, but would need to go a specific side. Hence the double-controllable bridge.
Besides, the river freezes in winter.

[Spish]

I had an idea like this a while back, and just kept it to myself. So I am very interested in seeing this happen