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[Sirus]

I've been looking for work for some time, and haven't been having much luck. I'm afraid that a good part of it is my past work experience; or to be more precise, the lack of it. Lots of "empty time" on my resume, without a lot of paid experience and only a year of volunteer work. I'm afraid that employers see it as more of a hindrance than anything else.

For a while I've been contemplating just not including any experience when I apply for work, though I'm not sure if it would be better or worse in the eyes of employers. Any advice?

[nenjin]

I don't think you can avoid it. Even if you don't state your experience, you'll have to provide an answer when asked. I'd start thinking of ways to creatively frame your downtime. Employers like hearing that, if you weren't getting paid, at least you were motivated to better yourself in some way. Motivated employees are productive employees.

Doubly so when you have no real work experience to fall back on. When an employer sees you don't have a lot of tangible work experience, period, they ask themselves "Are we gaining or losing value by hiring this person that will have to be invested in to be successful?" If you present yourself as eager to learn, self-motivated, capable of figuring things out on your own....that makes you a far more attractive prospect, regardless of your work experience. It's just, when you have no work experience, personality is THE thing that sells you to an employer.

In many cases, that means lying to an employer about who you really are in your downtime. If you turn out to be a fit for the company, it gets overlooked. If you turn out not be a fit....it's seen for the lie it is. In this economy though, I'd say go for it. Just getting your foot in the door is its own thing, you can worry about living up to the expectations you set if you actually get hired.

In any event, don't fall back on any old activity in an attempt to pad your resume. Things like "I volunteer at the animal shelter" and "I write a freelance column on video games in my free time" is white noise to an employer unless it's germane to the job you're applying for. Now, stuff that's of note, like volunteering at prestigious places or for really important work, that can be an asset when applying. It depends in large part on the kind of company you're applying to. Large businesses have a different culture than smaller one, which are both culturally different than full blown corporations. Franchises value different things than Mom & Pop establishments, ect...

As someone that has talked their way into plenty of jobs, I can just say: eye contact, honesty and assertiveness have gotten me hired where my resume/application/work history wouldn't have.

[Mephansteras]

Show what you've done and have explanations for the times that you weren't working/in-school.

Also...what kind of work are you trying to get? In some cases, being able to show off personal projects can really help. Programming projects, Art portfolios, and the like can all help make up for a lack of paid experience.

[Sirus]

@ nenjin: Part of the problem is just getting in to talk to anyone so I can explain the downtime. Lots of businesses around here have moved to online applications, and on the rare occasions of getting to meet a manager or store owner you just get a stock answer of "We'll call you if we're interested". When I do get to talk to anyone however, I always make sure to go in with a smile and some honest answers.

@ Meph: Anything, really. Most of my applications are to chain restaurants and the like, since they are the only places hiring on a semi-regular basis. Problem is that there are several high schools around here and, if you go to nearby cities, at least a dozen colleges and trade schools. There's a lot of competition for a very limited job market.

[Tellemurius]

For me i put down skills that i feel like i am adept to. I don't have any to back them up but employers can still look at it and think.

[nenjin]

And your current demographic is...what? Pre-college age, post-college age....?

ots of businesses around here have moved to online applications, and on the rare occasions of getting to meet a manager or store owner you just get a stock answer of "We'll call you if we're interested".

This is pretty much what I alluded to when I was talking about company culture. Corporations and chains (ESPECIALLY chain restaurants) have their own culture that demands work experience. Unless they're desperate for staff, they're going to at least talk to anyone with kitchen experience before you. (I did about 7 years of kitchens from high school through college.) Are you applying as a cook? You will definitely have more success as a dishwasher.

When you have nothing else going for you besides the human element, seek out businesses that let you capitalize on that. Smaller businesses. Family owned restaurants, start-ups and the like. I know it's shitty out there right now. I was in the same boat a little over a year ago (big employment gaps, eclectic work experience...), and by sheer luck I got a job with a friend at his company who happened to be looking for entry level people. We do over $1 million in business a year right now....and they're still on paper applications. It's a very small (less than 20 people) company.

Another thing you can try is applying for jobs at the colleges. They're generally online applications but they're used to a) people with no job OR life experience and b) temp workers. I turned a 6 month temp job working for a research outfit into like 3 years of part-time employment, just by checking the help wanted pages for the U and taking a shot in the dark.

[Mephansteras]

@ Meph: Anything, really. Most of my applications are to chain restaurants and the like, since they are the only places hiring on a semi-regular basis. Problem is that there are several high schools around here and, if you go to nearby cities, at least a dozen colleges and trade schools. There's a lot of competition for a very limited job market.

Hmm. Well, back when I was in college I started working temp jobs through a staffing agency. No idea what your area is like, but for San Diego at least it was pretty steady work. Most jobs didn't last more than a few weeks, but there was almost always another job available the following week. And the pay was better than most jobs of the same level. Most office jobs just need basic computer skills, which obviously you have. And if you're actually competent and willing to get stuff done you'll find yourself standing out really well compared to the rest of the temps.

Another option is Craiglist jobs, which tend to be for companies too small to use any sort of automated system. I don't have any person experience with that, though, so I don't know much about the practical side of it.

[Sirus]

I'm 24 and in college right now, so...college age, I guess?

You will definitely have more success as a dishwasher.

Funny story: I actually applied as a dishwasher for a small restaurant in my area. They wanted a year of dishwashing experience, and washing dishes at home didn't count.

I'll try applying at the various schools though. Maybe they need a janitor or something.

Well, back when I was in college I started working temp jobs through a staffing agency. No idea what your area is like, but for San Diego at least it was pretty steady work. Most jobs didn't last more than a few weeks, but there was almost always another job available the following week. And the pay was better than most jobs of the same level. Most office jobs just need basic computer skills, which obviously you have. And if you're actually competent and willing to get stuff done you'll find yourself standing out really well compared to the rest of the temps.

The only temp agency in my area is for early-morning, unskilled manual labor. I might end up doing that anyway, but right now I have classes to worry about.

Maybe I should give Craigslist a shot.

[Mephansteras]

Another option is the self-employed route. If you're good at any crafts you can try making those and selling them on Etsy or wherever, which is good if you can pull it off since it gives you a flexible schedule. I've also heard of people buying stuff at garage sales and whatnot and then selling what they find on Ebay for a decent amount. Just another option to consider, especially since being able to show entrepreneurial spirit can really help when getting jobs after college.

What degree are you getting?

[Sirus]

Nothing fancy right now. An A.S. in Computer Science with emphasis in Database Management and Programming. However, I am attending a community college instead of a university, so until I have the actual paper I don't have a whole lot to show.

[Mephansteras]

Nothing fancy right now. An A.S. in Computer Science with emphasis in Database Management and Programming. However, I am attending a community college instead of a university, so until I have the actual paper I don't have a whole lot to show.

Ah. Well, I certainly recommend working on your programming skills and doing some side projects on your off time. Might not help with getting a job right now, but will certainly give you an edge trying to get a real job after college. I also suggest getting your resume up on dice with an emphasis on any programming/database/web skills you have. You may be able to get some sort of entry level position out of it (especially if you look for telecommute positions).

[Tellemurius]

Nothing fancy right now. An A.S. in Computer Science with emphasis in Database Management and Programming. However, I am attending a community college instead of a university, so until I have the actual paper I don't have a whole lot to show.

education is education, you take one class of programming thats at least good enough for beta testing and bug fixes, take for example my job, half of year of sql and you will be able to work on any of our databases.

[weenog]

I had a lot of trouble writing a resume, and the advice I kept getting was: less is more.  Don't say in a paragraph what you can say in half a dozen words.  You want your resume to be a brief, snappy read that doesn't feel like a chore to look over.  You also want to cut details where you can, and leave room for the imagination, to help the hiring manager envision a place for you.

For an example from my own resume, where I could have said "Checked and refilled paper towel dispensers, toilet paper, and soap dispensers, changed burnt-out light bulbs and tubes, replaced waste basket liners, replaced cleaning chemicals, left notes to clients to inform them when stocks of these items were running low," I instead said "monitored supply inventories, requested and replaced consumables as necessary."  The first one is a horrible drag to read, and it's too specific, it sticks me firmly into a janitorial niche in the reader's mind.  The second option is much more concise and easy, and it leaves room for the reader to think "Hey, this guy could easily keep the pizza topping bins full and unspoiled, and tell me how much food I need to order each week."

A hiring manager doesn't need or want your life story.  He wants to get a sense - with as little personal time and effort as possible - of whether or not you'll easily become an asset to the business.