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[Laserhead]

What is a good bunker setup for crossbows that are above what they are trying to shoot? I've got a room, and below that a few levels of empty space, and below that a place for enemies. Can dwarves standing on top of fortifications shoot downward? What about standing on floor bars? Or do I just need to bring in the masons and shoot chunks of constructed floor instead of bolts?

[Loud Whispers]

Dwarves can shoot through fortifications and floor bars. Though if they're standing on top of a fortification - they won't be able to shoot through it. Simply because they're standing on the floor above the fortification, which blocks all fields of fire so no.  And if you can successfully create a system to drop constructed floors on invaders, it is absolutely assured !FUN!

[Garath]

maybe not if your marksdwarves are still standing there

[Azure]

Sorry, Fortifications have a floor under them so no dice. Just carve fortifications into the sides or if its a cavern just dig out multiple observation platforms to shoot from. Stagger for overlapping Fields of Fire.
     Roof
     |  |
     |  |
____  ____
|            |
|            |
____ _____

[Urist Da Vinci]

I just tested this by creating a fort and building some grates and bars, and then going there as an adventurer, and you can't see or shoot through floor grates or floor bars.

[NonconsensualSurgery]

I just tested this by creating a fort and building some grates and bars, and then going there as an adventurer, and you can't see or shoot through floor grates or floor bars.

I believe there was a time when you could, but it was nerfed because this plus the impossibility of building destroyers breaking grates from below was too powerful.

Fortifications have a solid floor on the bottom, plus a solid walkable floor on the top if carved from natural stone. If the OP want marksdwarves firing down then it's best to go for an approximation; they'll shoot down at an angle through an elevated fortification, and the maximum angle is pretty steep.

[Eric Blank]

45 degrees, actually. Marksmen on the first floor above a passage can shoot anything in said passage (accepting that the passage does not run underneath the paltform they're on.) Marksmen on the second floor can shoot anything that isn't directly adjacent to the wall they're standing on. For every floor up, the horizontal distance the target must be from them increases by one.

It looks like this:

Code: [Select]

.......☻ - marksdorf
....../# - walls
...../.#
..../..#
.../...#
../....#
./.....#
/......#
Anything on the diagonal line or above it may be shot, anything beneath it is too close.

[krenshala]

This is why meat-space fortifications added embrasures in towers that looked along the defensive wall and not "out" at where enemies were expected to appear.  The idea was that those firing positions would allow the defenders to shoot at anyone attempting to sap, climb, or otherwise defeat the wall.

Code: [Select]

top down view -- O wall, X fortification, + floor
Lower level, with firing positions and a hallways between towers.

OXOXO                 OXOXO
X+++X                 X+++X
O+++OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO+++O
O+++++++++++++++++++++++++O


Top level, with more firing positions, and merlons/crenelations/embrasures (hard to tell with the way DF does stuff ;).

OXOXO                 OXOXO
X+++X                 X+++X
O+++OXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXO+++O
O+++++++++++++++++++++++++O



[daggaz]

But since nothing (unfortunately) climbs or attacks walls, they are not really necessary.  In DF, its just as effective to dig a trench adjacent to your ground level fortifications (simply to keep enemy units from using them against you), and to fill that trench with traps.  Or magma. 


X_X  ____  X_X
     U       U

X is fortification, _ is floor, and U is a trap filled trench.   Dont forget to put ceilings in on your shooting gallery tho, to keep fliers out.   Also, not there is no height difference.  You take a penalty for shooting down a zlevel, rather than getting a bonus.

[krenshala]

But since nothing (unfortunately) climbs or attacks walls, they are not really necessary.  In DF, its just as effective to dig a trench adjacent to your ground level fortifications (simply to keep enemy units from using them against you), and to fill that trench with traps.  Or magma. 


X_X  ____  X_X
     U       U

X is fortification, _ is floor, and U is a trap filled trench.   Dont forget to put ceilings in on your shooting gallery tho, to keep fliers out.   Also, not there is no height difference.  You take a penalty for shooting down a zlevel, rather than getting a bonus.

Ah, but if you put an artifact door into the center of the wall, that leads to some portion of your fortress (i.e., the main training ground for your melee troops, overlooked by the walls covered in marksdwarves) ...

[acetech09]

But since nothing (unfortunately) climbs or attacks walls, they are not really necessary.  In DF, its just as effective to dig a trench adjacent to your ground level fortifications (simply to keep enemy units from using them against you), and to fill that trench with traps.  Or magma. 


X_X  ____  X_X
     U       U

X is fortification, _ is floor, and U is a trap filled trench.   Dont forget to put ceilings in on your shooting gallery tho, to keep fliers out.   Also, not there is no height difference.  You take a penalty for shooting down a zlevel, rather than getting a bonus.

Ah, but if you put an artifact door into the center of the wall, that leads to some portion of your fortress (i.e., the main training ground for your melee troops, overlooked by the walls covered in marksdwarves) ...

Common belief is that artifact doors can't be destroyed. They can't, but they CAN be unhinged and broken through by building destroyers.