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[JasonMel]

For my next suggestion, I would like to propose that wood furnaces generate smoke, and all smoke carries risk of smoke inhalation which works much like miasma except that it causes death with prolonged exposure.

The smoke should attempt to rise to the highest point available, and should not dissipate until it reaches the outdoors, at which point it would become harmless, much like forest fire smoke. If no escape can be found, it should accumulate up to a maximum density and then begin to fill lower levels until all available space is filled. I suppose this means it should act partly like miasma and partly like an upside-down fluid with only 1/1 depth and no pressure. Since smoke is an undesirable waste product and not useful, I don't think players would mind or notice a more naive implementation than exists currently for fluids.

Thus players could either place wood furnaces indoors with a vent to the outdoors, or simply build the furnace aboveground. This would enhance gameplay by either creating the need for constant, open connection to the outdoors without creating a security hazard, or encouraging the player not to abandon the above world entirely.

There are certain things that can be done in Dwarf Fortress legally but which I find inelegant or unrealistic to the point of feeling like a cheat. Operating wood furnaces indoors with no ventilation is one of those.

[Zurvan]

A very interesting suggestion. But perhaps there are other ways of modeling this behavior, such as checking for a path along the z-axis to an outdoor tile during construction of a furnace, by rough analogy to trade depot accessibility. We all know that miasma is a frame rate killer, and my real concern is that this would be an unnecessary burden without the possibility of circumvention, even if the smoke paths directly up for twenty tiles and then dissipates outside.

[peskyninja]

We all know that miasma is a frame rate killer

never heard about that,is that true?

[JasonMel]

A very interesting suggestion. But perhaps there are other ways of modeling this behavior, such as checking for a path along the z-axis to an outdoor tile during construction of a furnace, by rough analogy to trade depot accessibility. We all know that miasma is a frame rate killer

Oh, really? I hadn't noticed. Would you then disallow furnace operation any time no path to the outdoors exists?

I did think of one possible use for smoke: Fumigation of vermin. It kills not only dwarves, but flies, rats, etc. So if an area is particularly infested, closing it off except for a hole that lets smoke enter from below will rid the area of the infestation. Probably not terribly practical, but simple in theory.

I won't even get into smokehouses for meat and fish.

The interaction with miasma is something to think about. I assume that smoke rises and miasma sinks, and a tile with any of one is considered a full tile by the other. No mixing.

[Footkerchief]

Please search before posting.  Ventilation has been discussed many times, often in the context of smoke:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=4226.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5698.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=57501.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5303.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=32784.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=28699.msg366879#msg366879
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=46062.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=50320.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3862.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3863.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=5394.0

Spoiler: tags (click to show/hide)

smoke smoky heat hot air miasma ventilation ventilate burn burning combust combustion combusting

[JasonMel]

Sorry!

I had been getting better results with Google searches of Bay 12 Forums, so I've been searching these forums from there, and I swear I did search there for this suggestion before posting it. Maybe I'll start using the Simple-Machines-based search as well when posting suggestions. I did think it was a little surprising that it hadn't been discussed before.

[As an aside, I like your propic! It's got *sauce*!]

[Footkerchief]

No prob, and thanks!

[UberNube]

Since smoke is an undesirable waste product and not useful, I don't think players would mind or notice a more naive implementation than exists currently for fluids.

I like this idea, but do have to call foul on that statement. We are DWARFS, or possibly !!DWARFS!!, and there is NOTHING which cannot be used to kill elves, including other elves! If smoke could cause a syndrome by inhalation then it would be ripe for weaponisation in some kind of upside-down drowning chamber. Basically a gas chamber.

As for implementation it may be difficult to make this very efficient. Perhaps the best way to simplify it would be to do the calculations more slowly, say only updating once every 50 or 100 steps. That would reduce the CPU burden considerably and allow it to spread the calculations out so that it's only doing 1/10 or 1/100 (not sure how often water updates) of the processing each frame. Effectively update 1/100 of the required tiles each step. In fact, this could be used to optimize everything which is non-time-critical, such as temperature of solid rock/walls (dwarfs would need step-by-step updates), events in unexplored regions (who cares how slowly water flows in cavern layer 3 when you haven't even reached layer 1), weather calculations (I really hope these aren't currently done every step), etc. Also, make there be 3 concentrations of smoke rather than 7, since that may speed things up slightly (not much though).

[simonthedwarf]

tldr

but,

need more dwarfs INHALE!

[JasonMel]

I just realized that underground forests are possible (I've heard of them, just never seen them in a game), which means underground forest fires should be possible. (If they aren't, just ignore this post.) Such a fire would produce smoke hundreds of times more quickly than a single wood furnace, and would quickly wipe out a fort under this scheme if ventilation is insufficient. I'm not sure what to do about that.

Maybe it's one reason to look for deep soil in an embark, rather than flooding an arbitrarily deep, mined-out stone layer, so that the planned UG forest would be higher than everything else. As long as smoke behaves like water in that it can't fill to a higher level than its source, dwarves deeper than the fire would be relatively safe.

[peskyninja]

I just realized that underground forests are possible (I've heard of them, just never seen them in a game), which means underground forest fires should be possible. (If they aren't, just ignore this post.) Such a fire would produce smoke hundreds of times more quickly than a single wood furnace, and would quickly wipe out a fort under this scheme if ventilation is insufficient. I'm not sure what to do about that.

Maybe it's one reason to look for deep soil in an embark, rather than flooding an arbitrarily deep, mined-out stone layer, so that the planned UG forest would be higher than everything else. As long as smoke behaves like water in that it can't fill to a higher level than its source, dwarves deeper than the fire would be relatively safe.

trees are unburnable in this version 

[JasonMel]

trees are unburnable in this version 

I know, but is there any underground ground cover that can burn? My current fortress is plagued by an above-ground, fire-breathing titan. The fireballs do zero damage to even unarmored dwarves, but are remarkably efficient in causing any and all grass to go up in smoke in massive brush fires, though no trees or shrubs ever burn.