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[blizzerd]

is it a military based structure of some sorts, or is it a town/city?

why do cities turn out so big on the map and "dwarf forts" so small? it seems currently that player made forts are something entirely different then anything on the map

[Nasikabatrachus]

A little of both. Basically, a polis like Athens or Sparta, but affiliated with a larger group. Based on the ability of a typical player-run Fort to generate art and wealth, the comparison to great cities in our past is apt. I imagine a successful Fort as being somewhat like Austin, Texas, or Paris, France, or New York, NY: powerful centers of culture which don't necessarily have huge military/political impact but which are engaging in constant cultural ferment in a way other places aren't. This will no doubt change once the Army Arc rolls along, and to a smaller extent with the Caravan Arc.

EDIT: Er, not so much Sparta as Athens. More Sparta after the Army Arc.

[imperium3]

Also it's because (as you will notice if you play Adventure Mode) NPC Dwarf forts, as well as elf refuges and goblin towers, don't technically exist at the moment, they are just a marker on the map. I think Toady is planning to rectify this once the human cities etc are done, and then they'll likely be much more complex than they used to be.

Mind you, I'd still think a dwarf fort would look quite small on the map since most of it is underground...

[noodle0117]

^Indeed.
Looking at some of the designs dwarf overseers have made before, many forts can contain vast underground complexes while appearing to be nothing more than a small stone shack with a trading depot at the top.

[Triaxx2]

Cities are things like New York. Huge masses of denizens drawing in art and interesting things.

Dwarf Fortresses are like Topeka. Not a lot of people comparatively, but more creativity because there's fewer distractions. (Note, I have nothing against Topeka, the name is used only because it's a humorous name.)

[Dreggon]

Hopefully technology will advance enough in the next 10 years that we can embark on 16x16 areas, get 100+ FPS with 150+ dwarves, carnival open, and consider that 'laggy'. Then we'll make an impact on the world.

Until then? Your fort is going to be tiny.

[Captain Xenon]

keep in mind, a human city works in two dimensions, while a dwarven city has Depth as well. both humans and dwarves build a compromise between safety and efficiency. humans construct everything, dwarves tend to dig it out. humans use the castle as their burrow, and call peasants inside during a siege... dwarves simply have a front door (and often a back door) to worry about.

a lot depends on the design. i prefer to have a winding entrance corridor with raising bridges (full of traps, and a couple kittens), then the trade depot, trade storage, and animal stockpile, and then the rest of the fort. wall off and ceiling over a pasture section outside somewhere as well. one stairwell down to the bedrooms, a separate shaft down past the caverns to the magma workshops. a cistern from the river for a well, with the jail and hospital close by. and i usually put out a perimeter wall as well.

recently, it makes a lot of sense to dig out a lot of space in the dirt layer, as this provides bushes and trees that you can reach without going outside or without going into the caverns below.

i think the design of a fortress is by necessity an emergent property from the current version we play. a 40d fort is nothing like a fort with the newest version.

[Starver]

Mind you, I'd still think a dwarf fort would look quite small on the map since most of it is underground...

I tend to make a bit more outstanding entrance.  But, at best, I think I'd aim for something like Tracey Island.

(#Dum-di-di-dum-di-di Dum-di-di-dum-di-di, Doo-bidi-doo... doo-bidi-doobidi-doo...#)


Hmmm... megaproject-onnan-island?