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Author Topic: Glass trap components  (Read 5436 times)

Neowulf

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #30 on: April 01, 2011, 12:12:33 am »

Serrated disks are good for hacking limbs, and get multiple attacks. A trap with 10 disks gets 30 attacks on the target when the trap  triggers, though it leaves a huge mess.

Spiked balls also get three attacks a hit, but are designed more for armored foes or just causing pain.

Axe blades, instead of dealing three rapid hits, do one large hit. If it is better then disks is under debate.

Screws deal huge penetration damage.

And spikes are, well, spikes. Like the spiked ball, but more penetration.
And that says almost nothing about how they work in practice.
From the tests I've done glass components don't work like metal ones do. They're sharper sure, but the other stats are different so they behave differently.
My masterwork steel serrated disc traps of previous forts went snickersnack on invaders, severing limbs and pretty much insta-killing anything. Armored or not. They also tended to jam on the first kill in my experience.
My masterwork glass serrated disc traps did much less severing, usually ending up shredding gobos without actually killing them or attempting multicellular binary fission. They are much less prone to jamming.

Different materials, different effects. Different effects, different ways to effectively use said components.
Want a low maintenance trap setup? Glass discs or spikes. Want a sure kill layer? Steel discs or silver balls. Want to weaken invaders so your military gets some easy kills in? Glass balls do a good job of bruising muscles and breaking bones without killing.
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Alastar

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #31 on: April 01, 2011, 03:45:05 am »

I'd match the material to the trap component and purpose. In the main killzone, glass blades will slice up unprotected bits without more insta-kills than desired that just end up getting our traps stuck - a very welcome addition. Metal spikes will get some penetrating hits even against armoured opponents, to avoid training up armoured goblins without harming them. I don't trust glass for this job because its low shear strength translates into weak anti-armour performance.
Inside the main killzone, steel/candy disks. Valuable room decorations, they kill reliably (if messily) and maintenance shouldn't be much of a concern here.
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Psieye

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2011, 05:44:12 am »

Just wish I could equip my dwarves with lab coats.

You mean, WHITE ROBES? or WHITE JACKETS? Depending on the length of the coat, of course.

White capes would do in a pinch. Problem is there is NO WHITE DYE in the Dwarf Fortress universe. Red, Blue, Green, and Black. No white. Can't we grind up all those bones or something? Making all my fortress wear be dyed a nice white made from cat bones would be just so nice.
It shouldn't be hard to mod in white dye. I've modded in violet dye for my forts.



Also, I believe anything with [CAN_LEARN] can get skill improvements. So yes, goblins could get trained while going through your trap lineup if they were freakishly lucky. The objective then, is to kill them when they dodge by taking advantage of their change in position.
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Military Training EXP Analysis
Congrats, Psieye. This is the first time I've seen a derailed thread get put back on the rails.

Neowulf

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2011, 10:37:37 am »

Ok, I think I've gone through enough goblin volunteers on this fort.

Everything was done with masterwork mechanisms and exceptional/masterwork components (first two moods were mechanic and glass maker).

Spikes- Came out on top for killing without jamming, very little severing. Consistently gave fatal wounds, without actually killing, by the second round of attacks. Did a decent job against head and torso armor. Never jammed once.

Discs- Up there with spikes on lethality, gave fatal wounds without actually killing. More severing that spikes, but not nearly as much as metal discs do. Easily deflected by armor but does a good job of finding unarmored parts to slash.

Blades- Messy, messy, messy... Severed multiple limbs in each round of attacks, very prone to jamming. Turned 20 invaders into over 80 hauling jobs. Did good against metal torso armor, helms, and shields.

Screws- Extremely deadly, severs parts like it's going out of style. Good against armor too, I've got combat reports of screws shattering skulls and tearing apart brains through *iron helm*s. Tends to send heads flying, and jams a lot.

Balls- Didn't do much more than bruise, repeated applications lead to generally intact and well tenderized goblins. Slows them down though, seems only really useful to soften up invaders for your military.


Thanks to Torgan and Lemunde we've got two confirming data sets on axe blades and discs. Would anyone like to chime in with their own experiences, help confirm observations?
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proxn_punkd

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #34 on: April 01, 2011, 10:42:22 am »

This will be the df version of, "Will it blend?"

"Goblin dust! Don't breathe this!"

And thanks for your results, Neowulf! That means *menacing green-glass spikes* can take some of the stress off Craftgates's silver industry, so more army dorfs can have *silver hammers*.
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Bognor

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #35 on: April 01, 2011, 08:00:23 pm »


Everything was done with masterwork mechanisms and exceptional/masterwork components (first two moods were mechanic and glass maker).

Spikes- Came out on top for killing without jamming, very little severing. Consistently gave fatal wounds, without actually killing, by the second round of attacks. Did a decent job against head and torso armor. Never jammed once.

Discs- Up there with spikes on lethality, gave fatal wounds without actually killing. More severing that spikes, but not nearly as much as metal discs do. Easily deflected by armor but does a good job of finding unarmored parts to slash.

Blades- Messy, messy, messy... Severed multiple limbs in each round of attacks, very prone to jamming. Turned 20 invaders into over 80 hauling jobs. Did good against metal torso armor, helms, and shields.

Screws- Extremely deadly, severs parts like it's going out of style. Good against armor too, I've got combat reports of screws shattering skulls and tearing apart brains through *iron helm*s. Tends to send heads flying, and jams a lot.

Balls- Didn't do much more than bruise, repeated applications lead to generally intact and well tenderized goblins. Slows them down though, seems only really useful to soften up invaders for your military.


This is quality data, Neowulf!  :D :D  Will you add it to the wiki
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Neowulf

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #36 on: April 01, 2011, 11:14:59 pm »

Never edited a wiki before, if someone else with an account already wants to they're free to do it. Though I'd really like confirmation from atleast 1 other source on balls, screws, and spikes first.
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Bognor

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Re: Glass trap components
« Reply #37 on: April 02, 2011, 07:00:07 am »

Never edited a wiki before, if someone else with an account already wants to they're free to do it. Though I'd really like confirmation from atleast 1 other source on balls, screws, and spikes first.

Editing is easy, and others can fix any problems with your edits.  But I commend your commitment to accuracy.
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