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Author Topic: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.  (Read 1765 times)

Strife26

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Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« on: April 24, 2010, 01:14:20 am »

Hello everyone. I've been trying to get to be a better writer for a while now. Honestly, I think that the setting that I've come up with is pretty good and has some cool characters and plot lines. However, my writing still leaves much to be desired. The best way to improve is practice, no? Therefore, I'm going to try to keep up a pace of writing a chapter of a story every day.

I was going to put these up on Fanfiction or FictionPress, but I really think that it'd be better if my fellow forum-goers (and honestly, this is the only forum I ever really post on) got to look at them too. It'd be appreciated if I could get criticism, irregardless of how harsh it is or what the subject (poor references, bad grammar, overuse of parenthetical (a real problem of mine), switching tenses, anything). I figure that I'll host them at another site, they tend to have some auto-formatting to make reading them a bit easier.


Okay. links to the stories that meet my minimum "see the light of day" requirements will go here. As soon as I find them again.


Heroes and Strife
     Yankee in Camelot plot type. Strife takes command of an ancient city and tries to save it from destruction. Surprisingly deep backstory, if one can recognize it.
http://www.fictionpress.com/s/2799990/1/Heroes_and_Strife

Resurgence
     Basically, it's a complaint about the handling of military matters in 28 weeks later. I went from the beginning assuming that America was smarted than a head of lettuce.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5923686/1/Resurgence
« Last Edit: April 25, 2010, 03:59:28 pm by Strife26 »
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Heron TSG

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2010, 09:52:06 am »

Well, I can help you with grammar and spelling and such, but I can't help you much with the story.

Quote
city's every decreasing soldiery
Quote
He'd could just damn these people's lack of tactics.
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than anyone on the plane plain(?)
Quote
Strife watched the Prince's body desecrated by Pain and drug dragged through the dust.
- also, isn't Pain dead?
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behind the chariot
- what chariot?
Quote
He had planned his own stealthy insertion to retrieve it
-I'm not sure about spy lingo, but I'm not sure 'insertion' is the right word to insert here.
Quote
whom they had thought dead

It turns out that Pain was alive at the end, but until then it seemed like an anachronism. Good writing, nonetheless.
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Pathos

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2010, 10:31:13 am »

I've just flicked through ( I'll read it properly later ) but a few things I noticed:

  • Almost every single one of your sentences is short, and in relatively large paragraphs. You should try to vary this a bit. It might be trying to help the action, but it inhibited it a bit as the paragraphs didn't flow as well. It was also pretty unnecessary. Example: "Strife eventually decided to go whole hog. He would hold the Eastern gate as the only major hero. Sigard, Alexander, and Roman would hold the West. There was cold comfort in the fact that if his plan failed, Strife almost certainly wouldn't live to see the city fall." could easily be "Strife decided to go whole hog. He would hold the Eastern gate, whilst Sigard, Alexander and Roman would hold the West. There was cold comfort in the fact that, if his plan failed, Strife almost certainly wouldn't live to see the city fall."
  • You use Strife as a way to refer to the character waaaay too much. Try and give him a nickname, titles you can use or vary it more with pronouns. This might just be a problem because of the short length of the story, but carrying it on would mean it would get more annoying.
  • A bit more description would be nice, and would probably alleviate the second point and help you out with the first. Example: Describing the infernal as disgusting etc etc in the second chapter, or giving some hint into a uniform they're wearing or anything like that would've been nice.

You're doing well, but I'm not sure chucking them on fan fiction sites works, since it's not fan fiction. =p You might also like to give the chap a different name, as you'll get whiny people calling the character a Marty Sue no matter how Sue-ish he is. ( As I said, I haven't read it properly, so I don't know. )
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Strife26

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2010, 03:58:05 pm »

Thanks for the comments. I'm going through Heroes and trying to make the suggest changes. I'll post the edited version when it's finished  (having to go to work right now, sadly)

Sorry that it took a while longer than expected, but here is the first chapter to my 28 weeks later related fiction, Resurgence.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5923686/1/Resurgence
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Supermikhail

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2010, 01:40:09 pm »

A fellow aspiring writer here! :)
From the get-go, "It was rare that a day could be so fair yet so foul." Honestly, it doesn't tell me anything. I've noticed it with my writing recently, and have been fighting it fiercely, and I hurry to share my experience. This sentence is just a filler. Because it sounds cool, I guess. But when I see it, my brain just goes "flop". Because I don't know how a fair and foul day looks. Or maybe I should get updated on my medieval descriptions.

To the previous critic: What are you talking about? This guy is going to make the next step in modern literature after S. Meyer! But seriously, it's bad. My personal opinion is, that making yourself a hero in your writing to fulfill your fantasies is just unethical.

Oh... I started from a wrong point. I'm used to reviewing here as I read. So, basics. On one hand, fiction is film for the poor. On the other hand, fiction is a feast for imagination. Whichever way, the most important thing after the plot for you is to make your story easy to visualize. The problem with your writing can be summarized as, you're writing a plot, instead of a story. A story, as a movie in a written form, usually progresses in scenes. The setting of a scene is given some description. But not too much. Just enough clues to visualize it. A scene has characters that have distinct dialogue and actions, and all those you have to describe. But again, give just enough clues for visualization. In your first chapter I saw only one character - Strife. And everything around just a battle report. Also, one of the worst enemies of a beginning writer is trying to sound cool. For example, "But they did."
Ah, a better way would be to post some links. If I could find those I used myself... Basically, when I'm in doubt, I google "improve writing" and "writing tips". A lot of useful stuff.


...I'm sorry, there are so many things which need to be worked on, that I ramble. If my critique got you interested, I can point out specific things.
My tip. It would be good to rewrite the Heroes' first chapter starting from either more or less landscape and troop disposition's description, or from the protagonist's internal monologue, his assessment of the situation, his introduction into the events, more or less lengthy.
A better tip. Why don't you start with a short story? It would be easier to handle. Well, a superb short story requires a lot of polish and skill. But it's easier to handle. And to edit.
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Strife26

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2010, 03:43:59 pm »

Well, thanks for the advice of everyone. I rewrote the first chapter of Heroes.

Interestingly, Heroes and Strife was originally going to be a short story. I had it set for a pretty strict four part structure (The old version would have followed with one chapter for the battle, then a chapter for the resolution). I think that I'm going to expand it.

I've found that my writing either tends towards really long winded essays or to using overly short sentences which don't give enough information. I've been trying to work on it. In defense of the fair and foul line though, it establishes that their are both very good and very bad things going on and is a reference to Shakespeare that (hopefully) hints at Strife being different from everyone else.


Interestingly, Strife as a character has increasingly departed away from myself. Years ago, Strife was just a convenient internet moniker, the last name of the lead of my favorite game. Now though, I think that he's got a fair bit of depth, as well as holding opinions that really heavily conflict with my own. I really should find a new penname, but I've used Strife26 for such a long time. Once I got a bit better, I planed to sign stuff with my Christian name, which'd hopefully decrease some of the suspicion that Strife is a Sue (and in my defense, he'd definitely an Epic style hero, who normally skirt the line anyway).

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Supermikhail

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2010, 01:43:36 am »

You're a funny guy, Strife. Well, as an author. You know, what Heroes is now?


A perfect popular history book about... some fantasy place.
Well, I can understand the semblance if the main character is a historian. But the readers are going to be put off by this style if it's not explained right off.
And, I don't know, the beginning makes Strife so chill... that it's simply incredible. I mean he is able to describe the fashion of the era in the middle of a battle.
Anyway, if I'm right, you need to insert more involvement into Strife's observations. A battlefield is not a place to consider architecture.

The rhythm has improved greatly. And overall style.

However, I must make a couple of points. First, don't underestimate the reader, second, do not play tricks with the reader. Ah, mostly the latter. Basically, you imply too much. Strife's outworldishness is in hints, and the reader is already supposed to meet the natives. You either drop the "other plane" for now (make Strife a mysterious warrior, maybe even omit the name), or explain it. Otherwise it's just unnecessarily confusing. Is Strife's origin so important to play with it? I'd think it's just a convenient setup for a fantasy story. No?

Last point. "Strife, doomed as he was, had appeared at the city a scant few weeks earlier." What? How does being doomed prevent him from having appeared here before? Is this some time paradox the reader isn't let into, again? Please make sense in your writing.

Again, the best cure here would be to explain Strife's origin right away.
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piecewise

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2010, 02:07:41 am »

I'll just tell you what people have told me for years and what I've learned after a while.

1.Never use the word "suddenly" if you can avoid it. There's nothing wrong with the word or anything but it tends to lead to bad writing unintentionally.

2.Don't add descriptive words where they're not needed. "Bill said" is usually better then "Bill said angrily". It should be obvious from the dialogue that he's angry.

3. Naming characters after emotions or simply naming them words is generally a bad idea. I say this because its neigh omnipresent in terrible fan fiction.

4.No one cares about what your character looks like in detail. Don't describe your character's looks and clothing in detail since the reader is going to envision them more based on their actions and personality then what you say. Drop a detail or two, guide the reader's imagination but don't sit there and spell it all out for them. Same thing goes for the environment.

5.Show, don't tell. Unless it's a first person narrative and the person is talking about their own feelings then it's always better to show what a character is feeling rather then just say they're feeling it. It works sometimes (look at lovecraft's style) but is hard to pull off effectively (you have to make the reader feel the way the characters are feeling in order for it to work).

6. Small words, big ideas. Never use a large word where a small one is equally effective. 

For your work specifically lets see...

"Morale is pretty good. We've settled pretty well into the rotational system. We've got the general security forces alternating clean-up, disposal, and security.

Doesn't really seem professional for military personal to be using such colloquial speech with a higher ranking officer does it? It's also broken up into three sentences when it could easily be one or two. Consider something like this instead:
Morale is high, the rotational system has been successfully implemented and the general security forces are alternating between clean-up, disposal and security. 

Careful on tone, since it can completely undermine a story if done wrong.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2010, 02:18:02 am by piecewise »
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Strife26

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2010, 06:52:21 am »

Yeah, a new short story I wrote. Diverting attention away from RPing, I guess.

God's Word
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Supermikhail

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2010, 02:56:38 pm »

So...
Well, it's pretty good. I should think much better than the previous entries.
On the other hand, although I won't deny that I skim most of what I read online, the story had a tint of bad fanfiction to it. After a quick analysis of my feelings, I decided it's because almost all of your sentences have the same structure. He did something. Or at least they begin this way. The protagonist does things. Try varying the sentence structure, and the surroundings should probably do something to complement the protagonists actions. Unfortunately I can't come up with examples right now.

Or maybe not... Well, for the second half my observation is correct.

Edit:
Well, and then I for some reason decided that it would be a good idea to edit the story myself.
That's what I got:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I guess the idea here is that you should look and try to guess why I thought a place should be changed. A hint: mostly it was because of a lack of consistency, or mixed  abstract and concrete ideas. Or redundancy.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2010, 08:46:58 am by Supermikhail »
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Strife26

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2010, 12:25:23 pm »

I tried to vary sentence structure more with this story, written for a contest on SCP.

Loyalty to the Foundation
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Supermikhail

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Re: Midnight Sea: Strife tries to become a better writer.
« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2010, 01:29:47 pm »

Uh... what is it about exactly?
You know, I as a reader could hardly be involved less seeing as this "story" really seems to be a fragment of something bigger promising an intrigue, action, conspiracy theories... And instead it just stops at that. It could work on a larger canvas, but I unfortunately haven't seen it. As it is I can offer a couple of criticisms (however, you following them won't make the story a Pulitzer winner).
First, it seems to be a recurring thing in your stories where you start with some abstract observation from the main character, without really introducing him. I think it starts the reader off in some confusion to the identity of the person into whose head s/he is looking. You know, people do it, but usually when they write in first person. It probably works because the reader is involved in a dialogue and expects everything explained to him in due time because, well, s/he expects her/himself to be talking to a sane person... And even in that case, the amount of information you shove on the reader in the first paragraph is just unfair, and I can't think of any reason for you to do so. The least you could do would be to try and ground the reader first in the physical surroundings of the character musing.
Second, you seem to rush the dialogue too much. So that Strife appears to be an individual with serious psychological problems. Even if Marshall et al. guy is quite intrusive it doesn't seem to be a reason to jump up and start beating the crap out of him. The same for the dialogue. He's too angry too quickly. It could really bear some prelude, Strife to be more professional and subtle, the guy, too.
In short, if you could space and rhythm you dialogue and character to character interactions a bit, it would be much more enjoyable.
Anyway, what's SCP?
Also, you haven't proofread it in one place, and I won't stand for that.
Ah, also
Quote
Relatively loose suit coat, hiding a shoulder holster? “Why the drink?”
Decide whether you are going to have the full access to the main character's mind, or not at all. There is no reason to put the last sentence in quotation marks... But there is a good reason to put a period after "coat".
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