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[Lightman]

Surely, you mean Sid Meier? Civ 2 and Pirates! were great fun!  

[ August 10, 2007: Message edited by: Lightman ]

[Angus the goblin killer.]

The thing is that Civ2 already existed and was fine before Sid did anything to it. He only added 2 things, Cheat Enabling and Babarian Airships. (They where like Zepplins)

And yet again I apolgize for my poor spelling.

[Stromko]

None of those games mentioned use the AI the same way that Dwarf Fortress does. Dungeon Keeper, The Sims, and Evil Genius are a bit more similar, but The Sims has a much smaller environment with very few characters, while DK and EG are dealing with much simpler environments and goals.

Personally I liked F.E.A.R. just fine, I even bought the expansion, I liked it much better than Doom 3 though not as much as HL2. FEAR's AI did indeed utilize smoke and mirrors more than actual intelligence, but it was a huge step forward... for FPSes! Also, just because games come in a box doesn't mean the designers are any smarter.

Off the top of my head I can't remember a game that presents as complex a situation as Dwarf Fortress, so I can't think of a game that could demonstrate a better AI than it has now. The dwarves don't appear to "learn" exactly but they do adapt and develop connections that can have massive effects on their behaviors.

"Rogust is upset at having witnessed the decaying of a loved one<developed>. Rogust is getting used to tragedy<adaption>. He can't remember the last time he had a drink." We can take it for granted but it's actually pretty damned profound I think.

Reworking the AI, therefore, would take a whole hell of a lot of work to recapture this complexity.

[schm0]

The link above to the actual paper seems to be broken.

http://www.media.mit.edu/~jorkin/gdc2006_orkin_jeff_fear.doc

That should work.

[mickel]

Yea, DF has to be one of the best sim games I've seen, period. I think what does it (at least for me) is the multitude of little things that all add up. There's tons of details, most of them minor, but the overall effect is profound. It's how sim games should be.

That, and the ability to set your own goals, as well as the shift of focus that comes as your community grows.