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[Chthon]

quote:Originally posted by Toady One:
<STRONG>We started adding body parts (and skill improvement) to our games partially as an outgrowth of our pen-and-paper Cyberpunk 2013/2020 games in the late 80s.  It also game out of our text descriptions of damage that didn't match up with the hitpoint counters going down, so we added more and more criticals and so on.  Of course, we didn't release any of our text games from the 80s and early 90s.  You can be very very thankful for this.  Example (from BASIC Dragslay):

"The skeleton hits you in the head with its short sword!  You lose 9 IQ points!  NO DUH!!!!  RETARDED!!!!!!"

Also, on the thread:  it's strange that bones and shells are disappearing from inside.  I don't remember the state of that off the top of my head.  You can have refuse bins if they get all nasty with crud, and the dwarves sometimes catch the flesh-eating bacteria from touching them.</STRONG>

Don't know, the refuse bin is quite inside really, I don't see how any of it could be considered outside halfway between the river and the entrance.  Maybe it had to do with the fact that some of the shells had been in the outdoor refuse bin first?  Maybe that was enough to get decomposition going?

[qalnor]

Not to knock the innovations of Toady and the IVAN devs, but I'm a little surprised to hear people here lauding complex critical hit tables and complex material types as 'new' innovations.

I can definitely remember games with hit locations in the 80's, and I have no doubt that some people played with them before then.

IVAN and DF are great innovative games, but the RPG mechanics are oldschool in many ways, which is a big part of why they're great games.

[Toady One]

I remember picking up a copy of Phantasie III some time after it originally came out, and it had limbing, although I don't remember if you actually dropped equipment from it.  It's from 1987.  I don't remember any before that, though there were probably a few.  I don't expect to find much done with BPs or material in the 70s, but maybe there's something sitting around.  I played a lot of the old text games, but it was mostly HP or some lipservice to BPs with no effects.

[Maximus]

Phoenix Command, baby.

[bbb]

um.. surely the bones/shells would be washed / cleaned before being chucked into bins..

.... otherwise.. those totems / bone crafts / armors would be just as toxic

i suppose there could be another building.. cleaner or whatever... so you get dirty bones/shells... and processed bones/shells

bins are not so much for making things not disappear... as in saving a bit of space... more you dig.. the slower the game gets.. bigger piles also slow everything down too.

which of course isn't much of a problem unless you have a slow machine

[qalnor]

The first time I remember a body part system was on some MUD on Genie. I can't remember the name but I think it was fairly popular.

Most games did sadly just use hitpoint systems, which I always did feel were pretty shitty systems.

[Genuine]

quote:Originally posted by bbb:
<STRONG>
i suppose there could be another building.. cleaner or whatever... so you get dirty bones/shells... and processed bones/shells
</STRONG>

I was just thinking of suggesting this. I figured that maybe bones or shells could be "cleaned" or "dried" in some fashion at either the farmer's workshop or a new workshop designed for it (not sure what it would be). This would effectively add a job and make a "storable" bone/shell product for use later, which would be very handy considering often times dwarves want these for fey moods and they are useful for converting into crafts/bolts.

[mrshirt]

Or, bones can last forever, but whenever they're refused they're all thrown into big, one square piles, destroying the ones at the bottom in the process.

I don't know if that was a serious suggestion, but it solves some problems plausibly.

[Zengief]

A taxidermy shop would be a great place for cleaning bones and for making furs instead of leather.  It could also use bones and fur to create stuffed animals and skeletons. These could be used like statues then.  If you are in an undead area, the skeletons could sometimes animate and become either pets or enimies from within.  Even the little vermin should be able to be stuffed.

But the best benefit would be the bone and shell cleaning so that things didn't rot.

[bbb]

i don't know if i want to cry or laugh.. i got so many shells now (mainly because i didn't use any!) that my dedicated shell/bone/skull pile is full!... none has disappeared so far

guess i better make some shell crafts... unless decorated items are now fixed... (maybe i should try anything but furnitures)