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Author Topic: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)  (Read 1109 times)

KaelGotDwarves

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Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« on: November 12, 2009, 11:43:07 pm »
Strangely appropriately rape for the x-com mod I'm working on-

I got a "Vile force of Darkness" the season right after embark.

Of a squad of lobstermen... with plasma rifles.

Well, I'm screwed. (I was in the middle of collapsing a sectoid dark fortress).

Here is the corresponding entity raw file. According to this lobstermen shouldn't show up until the same time as gobbos, or the 60+ pop mark.

Maybe it's something else I messed up, any ideas? I don't know but it's an awesome bug never-the-less. I kind of hope it remains when I actually release the mod. Meanwhile I'm checking to see if the lobstermen were already at war with the sectoids pre-embark.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Cavalcadeofcats

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2009, 12:18:46 am »
Could also be the
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_PRODUCTION:2], maybe. Wealth from the sectoid fortress pushing your value high enough to trigger an early siege?

Maybe.

Have you checked the errorlog for anything odd/relevant?
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KaelGotDwarves

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2009, 12:24:41 am »
OH. MY. GOD.

So 1 of my X-COM operatives survived by setting a food stockpile far underground at the bottom of the magma pipe I was going to collapse the Sectoid base into and having everyone rush supplies there, then sealing off the corridor. The rest were killed in the run for supplies.

The Lobstermen were just leaving at the beginning of Autumn, and I got a Snakemen siege 20 seconds later, scattering the Outpost liason and scuttling the trade wagons.

Also, even if the Sectoid base triggers the production and population count for sieges, I cannot have triggered [PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE:2]

Nothing in the error log.

so very screwed

EDIT: the Lobstermen stormed 2 out of 3 of the Sectoid towers, slaying all in their path. Only 2 were killed by guards.

I don't understand it. I never got an goblin or even orc siege before first winter, and now the 2nd and 3rd season I'm getting raped.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2009, 12:31:50 am by KaelGotDwarves »
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Cavalcadeofcats

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2009, 12:45:15 am »
Oh, the triggers are ANDs, not ORs? I had the vague idea that any one of the three would be sufficient. Checking the wiki...

Wiki's unhelpful.

Also, this is quite the adventure you're having. Keep up the updates!

EDIT: Ha! Any one of the progress_triggers will be sufficient to cause a Lobstermen invasion. Vindication! (And you probably either want to set your _PRODUCTION trigger a little higher, or avoid sectoid fortresses in future.)
« Last Edit: November 13, 2009, 12:47:57 am by Cavalcadeofcats »
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KaelGotDwarves

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2009, 12:57:33 am »
That makes sense. I knew that reclaiming fortresses adds to overall fortress wealth, but I didn't know that it triggers the production trigger. Maybe it's the population trigger that did the trick? In that case didn't know that other civ's populations can trigger it. This knowledge is no comfort to my X-Com operative.

He's walled in now at the bottom z-level with no pick and dwindling supplies. Either going to starve to death or deconstruct the wall and die at the hands of the snakemen.

EDIT: Winter has arrived and the snakemen left. I have 70ish food upstairs and I am sealing everything off for the time being. I don't have any underground seeds so I am digging channels upstairs so that if invaders come they will have to drop 10 z levels to get to my "outdoor" plot.

Double-edit: What the hell I just got 6 migrants! Back up to 7 manpower.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2009, 01:03:17 am by KaelGotDwarves »
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The13thRonin

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2009, 01:40:54 am »
This has the potential for a pretty epic AAR...
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KaelGotDwarves

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2009, 02:01:22 am »
Well, I'm just playtesting changes and the mod isn't done yet, but it's getting too fun so I'm playing...

Winter was eventless besides the migrants. I tried cleaning up a bit and built coffins but towards the end of winter I got restless and forbade everything outside except for my little walled-off farm plot. Spring came around and sure enough... two squads of Lobstermen in a siege.

Even though I picked up weapons from the fallen earlier, my men with no training stand no chance against them. So I remain walled off from the outside. Everyone is milling around the meeting room, with my original survivor (elected himself mayor after everyone died) is building higher skill in cooking, brewing, and growing. The Lobstermen are milling about outside...

EDIT: Summer came and the lobstermen left. The lobstermen had JUST cleared the map when "A vile force of darkness has arrived!"

Snakemen. wow, this is starting to get predictable.

Another season in... Our dedicated engraver made this.


Well, at least my men still have some spunk left in them.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2009, 02:24:11 am by KaelGotDwarves »
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Lancensis

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2009, 07:02:30 am »
I think it's because they don't have [BABYSNATCHER]. Or the [ITEM_THIEF] tag. Or the [AMBUSHER] tag. Think about how many Goblin snatchers/thieves you normally get a year. They'd just send seiges instead if they couldn't try to rob you first. Just set the progress triggers higher if you want them to arrive around the same time as goblins, or add the tags in.
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KaelGotDwarves

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2009, 07:19:14 am »
Quote from: Lancensis on November 13, 2009, 07:02:30 am
I think it's because they don't have [BABYSNATCHER]. Or the [ITEM_THIEF] tag. Or the [AMBUSHER] tag. Think about how many Goblin snatchers/thieves you normally get a year. They'd just send seiges instead if they couldn't try to rob you first. Just set the progress triggers higher if you want them to arrive around the same time as goblins, or add the tags in.
That's not the problem though, as it was already answered in the previous post. The tags do matter, but I got sieged two seasons before the earliest I've ever heard of WITH orcs, with triggers at the same as goblins, which are double those of orcs.

The problem is that embarking on a (large) town triggers any of the triggers, which causes insta-sieges.

So, with things as they are... I've been sieged 8/9 of the last seasons... pretty much as soon as one leaves, another starts.

Oh, I also found out that [amphibious] [underswim] invaders will jump in your water sources and wait there to ambush you, even beyond siege let-ups at the start of new seasons. I now have 7+ pages of invaders.
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Deon

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2009, 09:09:03 am »
Yes, early sieges is the lack of BABYSNATCHER tag. If you just strip it from goblins and remove their [CAN_SPEAK], it nets the same result.
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GenericOverusedName

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2009, 01:42:01 pm »
I fail to see the problems here. This sounds exactly like every session of X-Com I've played!
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Julius Clonkus

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Re: Well f%$k'd up: Sieges the first summer/2nd season hilarity (X-Com mod.)
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2009, 05:22:48 pm »
No, it's not. If this was like a regular X-Com session we'd get auto/snap/aimed chryssalid Fun in the middle of the night, with at least two dozen civilians running around to play with the Chryssalids. All while you forgot your lightbulbs. And your proper gear. And have 6 untrained rookies to serve as meatshield chryssalid fodder redshirt desperate countermeasure.

For real now, I'm looking forward to this mod. Too bad chryssalid attacks aren't really possible now, on the other hand...We got already enough Fun already.

That being said, I like Fun.
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