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[Gask]

I have been frustrated with the lack of difficulty with these two map choices.  At most you get careless in the beginning and let some undead elephants or a nightwing or something slaughter you.  But more often than not you just dig in and shut them all out.

I think it would be fun for these two map choices to have special effects put in place.  Like having  all normal living creatures and dwarfs spawn an undead version of themselves some time after death, nothing too potent but it would add character.  Or having the u.g. river run with blood or become otherwise undrinkable during certain seasons.

Vampires and the like could come out of the chasm.  Rotting undead from the river with a higher frequency than normal... just something to make it more of a struggle.

Thoughts?

[ August 26, 2007: Message edited by: Gask ]

[BlueDestiny]

I fully endorse the idea of dwarven zombies and ghosts.

[Reign on your Parade]

We support this idea, but we think that haunted should seem more like it's like the land itself is trying to disourage you from being there (say... no creatures whatsoever, a large unhappy thought from just being there, poisonous outside river.) Whereas terrifing ones are actively trying to kill you off. Zombie hordes attack periodically, dead dwarves rise from the dead with all the same skills able to use them (THATS how zombe weaponmasters come to exist), undead demons (SHUDDER) ect.

[ August 26, 2007: Message edited by: Reign on your Parade ]

[Savok]

quote:Originally posted by Reign on your Parade:
<STRONG>undead demons (SHUDDER)</STRONG>

The shudder is due to the fact that if those existed, undead tentacle demons would too, right?

[Grek]

I think it should be:
Sinister: More strange moods, with a chance that happy dwarfs go macabre. More vermin. Dwarfs go insane more easily. More scary looking engravings. only creatures are predators, rare undead peaceful creatures and unatural ones like werewolfs, nightwings, orges and yeti. Extra miasma from dead bodies. Food goes bad more quickly outside stockpiles.

Haunted: Ghosts sometimes form near dead bodies that give unhappy thoughts and make dead things near them give out extra miasma, but only rarely attack people. More strange moods, with a chance that happy dwarfs go fell or macabre(equal chance of either). Outside river is unhealthy, but not deadly.

Terrifing: Extra river attacks. Tentacle demons out of chasms, spirits of fire from magma and toad demons in underground water. Miasma seeps out of the ground. Dead bodies become hostile undead(100% chance for bodied non burried, lowered chances for graveyards and even lower for tombs). Extra moods, with a chance happy dwarfs go fell. Outside river is undrinkable, even wells and in-cave sources make you sick.

[Angela Christine]

It would be good if the chance of rising from the dead were related to the burial conditions of the creature in question.  A dwarf left to rot outside or washed down the river would have a good chance of rising from the dead.  One left in a proper graveyard, a little bit less.  Buried in a coffin, less still.  Dwarfs buried in tombs with all of their earthly goods would almost never rise from the dead.  Private tombs are time consuming to build, but they put the spirit of the dwarf to rest.

Monsters could be prevented from rising from the dead by using all their bones in crafts.  You can't rise as a skeleton or zombie if you have to run all over the map to collect your bits first.  Non-corporeal undead might still be a problem, having your bones turned into jewelry could make a spirit pretty angry.

[Reign on your Parade]

quote:Originally posted by Savok:
<STRONG>
The shudder is due to the fact that if those existed, undead tentacle demons would too, right?</STRONG>

A-yup.

[mickel]

Undead demons? Would that even work? Undead are living creatures that are bodily reanimated. Demons are brought into existance in a different way. But I suppose as long as they leave a body behind when they're destroyed and don't go up in smoke or something, that body can be reanimated...  

But I imagine demon's bodies being generated largely by the same kind of magic that brought them from inferno to begin with and that whatever is left behind after that magic is dispelled isn't much of a body at all.

In the case of possession, I guess their body would revert back to what it looked like before they changed it. I've also read stories where demons left behind large gems or whatever it was that was used as a focus for the magic that brought them here.

It'd be interesting to have demons leave massive gems behind when they die. I imagine those would be very valuable and extremely attuned to magic.

[Fieari]

I definitely like the idea of constant unhappy thoughts for simply being on an evil map.  Sinister -10, Haunted -20, Terrifying -30.  A constant source of unhappiness that cannot be removed, only mitigated.  This alone would increase the challenge.

Likewise, to keep the challenge up, perhaps cave adaptation could double the unhappy thoughts.  This would be ON TOP of cave adaptation, of course, meaning that going outside would still make them puke.  They're just even more miserable than before. Something like (for sinister) "Glod Thikmore was jumping at shadows lately.", (for haunted) "Urist Thrinbale is afraid of the dark.", and (for terrifying) "Ras Ferkar knows that doom is near."  Each of these three thoughts would be -10, and would be cumulative... such that on terrifying maps, cave adapted dwarves would have all three (thus doubling the flat penalty they get simply for being on the map).

This way, you'd be encouraged to NOT wall yourselves inside the safety of the mountain, to prevent miserable dwarves who are ready to fly off the handle at a moment's notice.  Of course, these penalties would not exist on neutral or good maps.

The best part of this system is that it works on the current mental process, and doesn't need any special cases for producing more dwarves going insane, or producing more fell/macabre moods.  It'll happen naturally.

[Reign on your Parade]

Well the demons have somewhere where they come from. If killed and reanimated there, then when brought here: undead demons.