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[Imp]

I had literally one self-target usable action until the game was over with scum winning, then I had 1 shot to try and undo the damage... and no idea what maf had to counter with.  I figured it was big and game wasn't over but would be like a minigame of maf deciding which counters to use on me... or trying to figure out why the game over hadn't happened yet and of the town alive who to mess with and how.  Was pretty intense for me.  I was scared to admit anything.

Set me up in a 'can't self target' and I can do nothing but the day game, until we lose and I get my 1 attempt to fix it and then (if maf don't sacrifice a maf to undo my empowerment... so I can move again at long last at night) can maybe continue to play if there's more maf.  But I didn't have kill immune until like after N3.

FoU's scar ability, if I'd ever gone where it was used.  I'd have only ever moved again if someone helped move me who could.  And N2... I was affected by one of Jack's buildings I think.  I didn't know and was TERRIFIED that I was already pinned forever.  With an immune to roleblock that didn't prevent disables... or 'lock agains'.  And a blue vote that... can't save my life.

This was a HIGH FEAR game for me, so much.

Love it.  More fear please

CM, I didn't help you get resources because I could not target you.

I was terrified to admit to anything.  I didn't know how deep cheating went.  I knew what I could potentially do.  Which was... so much maybe.  Just maybe.  So much fear

... and thanks, Jack.  So much.

[Imp]

And I also wanna say.  You guys are freaking amazing.  Many of you just saw me play as maf and do well.

Then this game.  Where I was weird.  Refused to claim anything.  Never did a confirmable action - when I was caught self-targeting at least once I also joined a genre chat and looked all maffy with maf help.

I was pushed pretty hard.  I pushed back pretty hard.

And I was treated well.  Given chances.  Allowed to play and try.  Even when several of you had just seen me be believably towny as maf.

You're incredible.  20/10 would absolutely maf with you all again.

[notquitethere]

Phew. You all made the right call in the end. Good job town! Especially, Elephant Parade and Imp.

NJW had an uphill climb at the end of the day there and you did an excellent job in the circumstance.

I probably shouldn't see it this way, but this game is a complete vindication of my scumhunting methods, as the players with the most suspicious voting patterns really did all turn out to be scum.

An apology may be in order to Crystal, because it turns out she genuinely did just have excellent instincts. Less work, more reward. I would suggest she make a vote though when she forms those suspicons as on two different days she correctly pegged scum (Juice on D2, NJW on D4) without getting around to voting them.

NQT, when and if you're open to lessons.  I could probably handle them from you.

Firstly, I'm not the best player so feel free to take this with a pinch of salt. I may have correctly voted scum three days in a row, but I was unsuccessful at not looking too scummy while doing it.

It's better to be fairminded and not rile people up who might be your allies

When you feel like you're being unfairly attacked, you feel a sense of outrage— I think we all do— but the fact is most of the time in this game town will be suspecting town. Indeed the players that form the most suspicions are usually town. So getting really mad at another player can be counterproductive. We had that rumble back and forth until basically I took the time to work out that you were probably town. If you'd been an ounce less uncharitable, then I wouldn't have wasted an action inspecting you (that was still a bad move, but I wasn't lying when I said the track wasn't a certain aspect). By uncharitable, I mean someone ignoring points because they think they're being made wholly in bad faith, focusing only on small points of disagreement.

Townreading is as important as scumreading

I think I already said this in the thread but it's imprtant to know who you most trust and then eliminate first from the pool of people you're not sure about. You get this, of course. You correctly trusted Crystal even when I couldn't see it. But a corollary of this is that it's as important to try to convince your fellow town players of your town reads as you scum reads. Now, there's no guarantee they'll see your argument, of course.

Paranoia has its limits

We've all been blindsided by some unseen mechanic in a game like this, and come away thinking if only I didn't make that assumption. But still, there are some limitats. Magma was never going to be completely insane in his setup design. Entertaining the idea of three mafia in duelist chat perfectly setting up their conversation to fool you specifically? Insane. Entertaining the idea of a 4/11 player mafia game? Also pretty insane. That really wasn't helpful, especially as it formed a part of the possibility space for your suspicions against me, a town player.

[NJW2000]

GG all... that was a very long game, about 21 days non-stop, with six levels of mechanical considerations.

Thanks for running it Mater - the flavour was very wry, and the mechanics were interesting.

I do feel like scum could have done more with the genre knowledge and interference - we tended to use it in fairly basic ways. There was a lot of interesting stuff going on there, room for some very creative plays. Scum night actions were also slightly scuffed, for obvious reasons. I don't know if I made the right call in the 3v1, but I didn't think I was going to get CM eliminated.

I think town could have claimed/coordinated their genre actions a bit less too... knowing which players were using family abilities and location knowledge kept us out of danger a bit more easily than was necessary.

[Imp]

I don't know if I made the right call in the 3v1, but I didn't think I was going to get CM eliminated.

I think town could have claimed/coordinated their genre actions a bit less too... knowing which players were using family abilities and location knowledge kept us out of danger a bit more easily than was necessary.

Hey, did you seriously consider not killing and how that might play out?

I suggested it, even strongly recommended it.

But I was hoping desperately that you just wouldn't do it.

By that point, 3v1, you had 2 ways to win.  Elim me, or NK me twice (any combo is fine).

Your NK would have been silent; I have the 1 protect that will go infinite once all other town are dead (since you're the last maf).

So your mech winning play would have been, though I was CRAZYDEEP trying to hide the idea and hoping it wouldn't get considered.

N5 kill imp (nothing visibly happens, I don't get told I ate a kill, I presume you don't get told anything about the kill working to take a protection use).

D6 try for an elim of anyone but yourself (who cares if it's Imp, mech doesn't matter much either way) or no elim.

N6 kill imp (imp dies).  If you elimmed anyone but me D6, you finally won.  Otherwise you're in a 2v1 with normal mech.

I felt like I was spotlighting myself to maf.  You had other problems.  A mechanically mysterious player is hiding something deep... or shallow.  I tried to wifom it with 'I am protecting the not-me town savior' but... I had VERY little to work with.  I was expecting fried imp for breakfast every single new day

[Imp]

Phew. You all made the right call in the end. Good job town! Especially, Elephant Parade and Imp.

NJW had an uphill climb at the end of the day there and you did an excellent job in the circumstance.

I probably shouldn't see it this way, but this game is a complete vindication of my scumhunting methods, as the players with the most suspicious voting patterns really did all turn out to be scum.

An apology may be in order to Crystal, because it turns out she genuinely did just have excellent instincts. Less work, more reward. I would suggest she make a vote though when she forms those suspicons as on two different days she correctly pegged scum (Juice on D2, NJW on D4) without getting around to voting them.

NQT, when and if you're open to lessons.  I could probably handle them from you.

Firstly, I'm not the best player so feel free to take this with a pinch of salt. I may have correctly voted scum three days in a row, but I was unsuccessful at not looking too scummy while doing it.

It's better to be fairminded and not rile people up who might be your allies

When you feel like you're being unfairly attacked, you feel a sense of outrage— I think we all do— but the fact is most of the time in this game town will be suspecting town. Indeed the players that form the most suspicions are usually town. So getting really mad at another player can be counterproductive. We had that rumble back and forth until basically I took the time to work out that you were probably town. If you'd been an ounce less uncharitable, then I wouldn't have wasted an action inspecting you (that was still a bad move, but I wasn't lying when I said the track wasn't a certain aspect). By uncharitable, I mean someone ignoring points because they think they're being made wholly in bad faith, focusing only on small points of disagreement.

Townreading is as important as scumreading

I think I already said this in the thread but it's imprtant to know who you most trust and then eliminate first from the pool of people you're not sure about. You get this, of course. You correctly trusted Crystal even when I couldn't see it. But a corollary of this is that it's as important to try to convince your fellow town players of your town reads as you scum reads. Now, there's no guarantee they'll see your argument, of course.

Paranoia has its limits

We've all been blindsided by some unseen mechanic in a game like this, and come away thinking if only I didn't make that assumption. But still, there are some limitats. Magma was never going to be completely insane in his setup design. Entertaining the idea of three mafia in duelist chat perfectly setting up their conversation to fool you specifically? Insane. Entertaining the idea of a 4/11 player mafia game? Also pretty insane. That really wasn't helpful, especially as it formed a part of the possibility space for your suspicions against me, a town player.

You helped the win!

By the end of D4, I wasn't sure about you.  By the start of N4, I wished I'd been brave enough to force a no-elim.

I was not sure at all about you.  My problem in part was a lot of stuff that looked scummy to me you appeared to gloss over and write off.

So did NJW and Sal.  And Juice.  And you weren't taking stances even later in the public thread.  Your reads and stances appeared to me to be a mix of 'this is town NQT' and 'I have never seen this before, but it looks wrong to me' (now I have seen you do this as town; now I hold it in your range as town)


Like this read:

Imp: Immediately comes in with suspicions developed over the night. Entertains highly tinfoil-hatted conspiracies (what if there are four scum and three of them are in the duelist chat??). It's not productive, but it is very towny in it's paranoid shadowjumping. Tries to work out the mechanics. Hems and haws between NJW and NQT.

That is a good, reasonable, accurate read.  You mix it with a worldview I don't share, but what you say you see me do is dead on.  ... except the sus wasn't developed overnight; it started D1 and was clearly and strongly expressed.  Towards NJW and Sal, and Juice already flipped by the time I'm in duelist.  My sus towards you is recent.  You got huge 'this is NQT' cred for how you approached me about CM's genre.  And how you set that probe up.  I read that from you as: that was very dangerous maf play and you're just checking the boundaries, you have me pegged - or extremely good townplay and tailored to send private messages to me that I would likely understand and others not catch, and require a bit of figuring out for me too - but the reactions of others surprised by it hold the keys I need to decode the harder bits.

Or that was all coincidence - apparently?  You legit didn't remember who you actioned?  You claimed that.  Which sounds a townie or scummy lie.  I was not thinking 'my hero needs help and isn't tracking'.  You lucked into a really useful message... but useful for maf or town and I wasn't sure who was what; CM could have been maf and you're giving me a strong sonar ping.  Juice looked awful in the ping; CM looked like a 'recheck everything, imp' and you looked like town hero doing your difficult job well - or maf sonar pinging me, likely with CM and juice help (CM isn't the only one self targeting - I literally can only self target until town loses the game), and I dunno who is maf so... you're terrifying.

Your phrasing here:

Imp

I'm not imagining it am I, NJW and Salvatore never converse in the duelist chat, it's always with me, right?

Umm.  I don't get the tone.  As town.  I don't get that you missed it.  To me this reads as total you are covering it up and trying to act like you just noticed and don't know this is real-true.  I believe you now.  But you go from mastermind as town or maf to... can you tie your shoes?  Can you track fewer than a hundred posts and notice who is and isn't talking to each other?

I'd already said I was in extreme doubt over the interactions there.  I'd already pointed out that you guys didn't talk to each other in a way I found believable, and it was almost entirely you to each of them and nearly never them to each other, the two exceptions looked to me quite sus.  And your lack of sus about it all looked... wrong to me too.  As wrong as them to you.

Imp

I'm not imagining it am I, NJW and Salvatore never converse in the duelist chat, it's always with me, right?

So, NQT.  You're pretty darn sure NJW is town.

Don't put words in my mouth. He's my #2 suspect! I literally said in my last post that there are good reasons to suspect him. That's not pretty darn sure at all!

I didn't think I was putting words in your mouth.  You'd appeared to overlook scummy stuff and entown and not seriously consider stuff I thought was scummy.  I mean, your read of me here:

Imp: Immediately comes in with suspicions developed over the night. Entertains highly tinfoil-hatted conspiracies (what if there are four scum and three of them are in the duelist chat??). It's not productive, but it is very towny in it's paranoid shadowjumping. Tries to work out the mechanics. Hems and haws between NJW and NQT.

As I said above... That is a good, reasonable, accurate read.  You mix it with a worldview I don't share, but what you say you see me do is dead on.

I can't tell you I have mech that is built to take this game with 4 maf and 3 in a duelist chat they can use as a toy or anything else and help ensure town wins, even put a bow on it.

I'm terrified I'm showing too much of 'Imp can fix it' anyway in that moment and before.  I just lacked the skill to townread you in that pit of a 'scum chat 2' that Duelist was.  What I read as your absolute blind-eye to just the scummy stuff.  Made me think you likely scum too.  You could read well.  You just appeared to be selectively not.  Intentionally selectively not was my best eval.

And we had 2 real scum in there.  Every word I said to you - they heard.  One was dead before I could say it.  But I was throwing sonar with every keystroke.  I had to echo-blind maf.  You looked like maf oh wow you did to me oh wow scared.  And the kinda maf that would do that?  What you guys did?  As 2 or 3?  I need to grovel and beg and dance and set you up so town can still win.

Remember - I have game breaking mech.  I unlock when town loses.  That is HUGE and means maf can be HUGE.  But I can't explain this to you because... there's definitely maf there.  I'm so sure of that... everything screams of maf there.

Remember CYOS1, when D2 I took Max in hand and danced him through case-making on those I was sus of and explained to everyone, 'if he's maf, the tricks that will fool the rest of you I will see; what will fool me will make him look more maf to you' - well.  I was brought into 'what does not fool Imp', but can confuse me.  I absolutely didn't easily pick you out from the mass (it was mass.  2/3 were maf in there.  The feel to me was strongly maf and that you didn't even sus them for stuff I thought was reasonable of town to sus - just made me more sure you have to go with the bathwater).

Even with that - I still didn't really want you dead by end of D4.  I was open to get off you.

And aware that I maybe faced 2 maf - if not you and NJW.  Then NJW and EP, two super-deep maf.

My role's build to tank that, if I'm alive.  It's plausible.  Bigger my role, the bigger the maf I think I hunt.  This is a variant of CYOS1 to me, it's 'that category of game, seen through an entirely different artistic medium and mod's expression'.  It's art and beauty and I know I'm capable of counterbalancing an absolute overwhelming tsunami of maf, or far less, depending on all the other stuff I don't know if is in play and the exact mech.

And you act pretty informed to my read.  Like you're convenience-reading, letting scumslips go (and they let yours go too!!!!  They don't sus you when they 'should' if town.  But you give them the same grace!  Maybe train your sus of that??)

Everything I do gets interpreted through the lens of "NQT is a master manipulator trying to craft a narrative" and everything Crystal does is "she just sucks at this game but also she has perfect reads". Now it's flattering I'm held to a higher standard and maybe I'm completely off base and NJW is actually scum or we're in a tinfoil world where Imp or Elephant Parade are bad. But I really don't see how people genuinely think I was on a team with both Juice and Salvatore. I think Elephant Parade is just being lazy and is in confirmation bias land and this might lose us the game.

See.  To me... what is not there but theoretically 'should be' is as visible as what is.  I have a very atypical perspective.

To the vast extent.  CM looks what I guess is called 'unpaired' - but with my eldritch-like observations.  She gets hunted by Juice (totally not passed over), hunted by you, who is not hunting much stuff I think you would as town (I'm wrong.  But I believed it).

I don't care if she scumhunts - I have a role that I dare claim nothing.  I read her as town with a difficult job.  And I better pick up the slack or we get cut to pieces.  It's what CM doesn't ever do and how she doesn't do it.  It's not - that was mastery-play from CM.

This is my pre-endgame eval of what happened to CM:

So.  CM.  Appears to claim:

Self target N1 to get resources
Target EJ N2 for worker.
Discovers cannot feed workers N3; reports prevented from acting; disabled.  Probably gathered resources instead.
N4 probably gathered resources.

CM probably town and probably effectively failed every action.

The thing is... she's consistent to that worldview.  The stuff that I think should be missing if she's real and true.  It's missing.  The 'sonar echo' of her is clean.  This is extremely likely to be town.  She's even getting attacked by maf.

Instead, the maf treat you as one of their own - and you treat several of them back with the same 'grace'.  And for whatever reason that prevents you from seeing what I see in CM - I mean.  This is inverse of Max in CYOS1, D2.  I know I think different.  I just... you are this game a weird mix of 'you look great' and 'Probably Does Need to Die' (PDND).

You do come across to me as you don't believe your own senses, you want to shape mine to yours.  You ask me if you're seeing right, and in the very next sentence tell me not to put words in your mouth.

Can we calmly see this from an Imp-eye view... sorry.  Sonar read:

Imp

I'm not imagining it am I, NJW and Salvatore never converse in the duelist chat, it's always with me, right?

So, NQT.  You're pretty darn sure NJW is town.

Don't put words in my mouth. He's my #2 suspect! I literally said in my last post that there are good reasons to suspect him. That's not pretty darn sure at all!

[/quote]

Yeah.  To me, with my life experiences.  This is gaslighting.

You want 1 answer. From me.  You want me to tell you what you choose to be told.  Everything else I tell you, you stomp.  And not in a 'nice way'.  There's nice stomps, towny stomps.  The 'I have boundaries and maybe you're trying to trick me' stomps.

Nah.  This is a full on direct mix of 'believe what I believe'.

Remember what Sal said in the maf chat?

NJW — 1/29/2025 2:59 PM
that will have been. 1 minute - add someone to duelist?
Sal — 1/29/2025 2:59 PM
Yes
NJW — 1/29/2025 2:59 PM
who?
Sal — 1/29/2025 2:59 PM
Imp?
NJW — 1/29/2025 3:00 PM
Sure, let's do that
Sal — 1/29/2025 3:00 PM
Could do EP instead
ok
NJW — 1/29/2025 3:00 PM
I can ask to change to EP if you'd prefer?
Sal — 1/29/2025 3:00 PM
nah, I picked Imp because I thought it was a good idea
NJW — 1/29/2025 3:01 PM
sounds good... I guess we might get a lot of info/insight into night plans out of it
might be quite a lot of talking involved
Sal — 1/29/2025 3:02 PM
Yes, and more importantly, two things
1) we can totally change Imp's view of the game so far
and 2) since the princess turned out to be scum, involving Imp in something suspicious-looking is good

You're doing it as town.  And you're probably doing it unconsciously.

But your techniques, even if incidental/coincidental.

You are trying to change my world view.  I'm like a dog you're training or something.  Is the feel to me.

You want me to give you the exact answers you want to hear.  And not hold you accountable or have my own ideas.  You want your ideas back from me.

You look exactly like maf.

Sal doesn't even NEED to work on that change imp's worldview plan.  They already have you spun so tight in their web - a web that doesn't even fit me, I'm sideways to it - that you are doing their work for them.

This is my view.

And I screamed about it because... I lack the skills to calmly shake your hand and the maf should have killed me if I did.  But you did masterful maf-work for maf there.  To my read and thinking.

I'm sorry.  You as town failed a bunch of my town checks.

I will try to recalibrate, and I will try to gently show you when I think you may need to groom the scum-slime off of you.

To me, having been fooled by Sal which you .... town you.  Would have realized you were and then not to recalibrate your thinking -

I think really highly of you, NQT.  I think your mind as town makes those leaps.  I see them sometimes.

I've only played like 3 games with you.  And life gets in the way as does health and whatever else.

I just messed up.  I couldn't tell maf you, which I've never met, from town you in this circumstance.

[notquitethere]

Yeah.  To me, with my life experiences.  This is gaslighting.

You want 1 answer. From me.  You want me to tell you what you choose to be told.

This is interesting. I should apologise as obviously the way I worded things rubbed you the wrong way and set off all sorts of red flags. But the thing was I was right! My observation that I was doing all the talking to Salvatore and NJW and they never grilled one another in chat was absolutely correct and telling for their alignment. But I couldn't get you to engage with that because the way I framed it, and your mindset at the time, meant it just looked like I was trying to trick you. I don't know what the lesson to take away there is. It wouldn't have got that far if I'd not acted hard on a wrong gut read around D2 or D3 and made you think I was scum for suspecting you of stochastic rolefishing.


NJW, Elephant Parade and Euchrejack (and anyone else I've forgotten), if you're free you should join the hat game.

[Imp]

Yeah.  To me, with my life experiences.  This is gaslighting.

You want 1 answer. From me.  You want me to tell you what you choose to be told.

This is interesting. I should apologise as obviously the way I worded things rubbed you the wrong way and set off all sorts of red flags. But the thing was I was right! My observation that I was doing all the talking to Salvatore and NJW and they never grilled one another in chat was absolutely correct and telling for their alignment. But I couldn't get you to engage with that because the way I framed it, and your mindset at the time, meant it just looked like I was trying to trick you. I don't know what the lesson to take away there is. It wouldn't have got that far if I'd not acted hard on a wrong gut read around D2 or D3 and made you think I was scum for suspecting you of stochastic rolefishing.


NJW, Elephant Parade and Euchrejack (and anyone else I've forgotten), if you're free you should join the hat game.

Yea.  I thought not only I but you as well already discussed that they were not talking to each other.  So... that direct question looked performative and... I just didn't catch that you were town that needed help.  I totally misread you as maf that was playing to twist, and I treated you like that, not... as a drowning townie needing help and surrounded by maf and maf lies and twisted by that.  I whoopsed.  And a victim of gaslighting (they maf, they gotta) + maybe some brainfog from you being sick recently or other life stress. -hey.  I'm sorry.  I thought you were bein' 'getting you back' type maf.

So, you are perhaps unaware of my mentioning and discussing the lack of conversation between them and the patterns between you three -  and your own mention and discussion of this (I get.  We can forget what we say and think, especially when there's recovery and you yourself are bathed in lies and carefully curated behaviors - which you absolutely were in that duelist chat.

Please forgive me, I did not have the ability or skill to read you correctly victim.

Here's what I did say, and you, about that idea:

This is me in the duelist chat, aimed at NQT, sal's already dead, the other alive in there is NJW

Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:13 AM
I'm flipping out about your thinking, your reasoning, and the concerns I have about you.
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:14 AM
And the lack of concern you two both have about each other!!
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:14 AM
And your lack combined lack of concern about SAL
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:14 AM
you're not acting sane or reasonable and without towny sus of scary flipping stuff


Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:38 AM
@Urist Confirm that you would not put 3 maf in the duelist genre. Or if you would.  Please.
I'm so I believe my evaluations, eyes, reads, and evidence.
I think it's possible.  Scary possible.
Y'all do look performative in here.
notquitethere — 2/3/2025 7:40 AM
I think it's rude to ask mods those kinds of setting design questions during the active game. It's angle shooting. You have to use your own intutions about game design.
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:40 AM
And the three of you, including sal.  Treated all 3 of you the same when there were 3.

Now you and NJW still do.

NJW less than you.  But yeah, it looks bad
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:41 AM
The mod answers as the mod chooses.  Ex-mod you know that.
notquitethere — 2/3/2025 7:42 AM
Sure, and as a mod I can tell you it's putting Magma in an awkward spot of trying to word his reply in a way that doesn't undermine his game. It's not good sportsmanship.
notquitethere — 2/3/2025 7:42 AM
Sorry Imp but this game is making you nuts. Go outside. Hug a tree. Think about probabilities.
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:43 AM
Reality has a 100% probability.

And if NJW is town, he needs to wake up.

If you are town, you need to wake up.
notquitethere — 2/3/2025 7:46 AM
I will say that I did scroll back through the chat because my impression was it was mostly me talking to Max or me talking to NJW or to both at the same time. Dunno if that's time zones, but there wasn't any back-and-forth where they were both talking to each other and that's a red flag. I think this is the only time they ever interact without me being there (NJW responding to a remark Max makes). ⁠general⁠
Eskcanta — 2/3/2025 7:48 AM
NJW also barely talks since I joined.
And only answers questions
And not even all of those
And directly suggested maybe I don't talk here,since it could influence the NK
notquitethere — 2/3/2025 7:49 AM
I think that may be NAI as not everyone has the time to chat on discord loads

So, my bold there.  The 'also' is clearly too weak.

Yes.  I think exactly what you say there.  Exactly.  Except I deeply sus you.  And am not trying very hard to pull you out of your... what I read as an 'illogic bath' from that specific direction.

I'm sorry.  I may not be capable of easily calibrating to... get that.  I'll try.  But to me that's the second time you claim you just notice.  I don't really believe you either time.  You don't seem sincere to me.

Here's where I say it most clearly:

I really believe that at least 1 maf is in this duelist genre chat.

NQT is very talkative and I don't like how he thinks.

NJW barely talks, too busy sure.  But he votes very helpfully for maf, with what we know is true.

They literally both could be maf.  I do not like what I read and feel in there.  Clearly it's ludicrous that they all three could be maf and when I asked mater to confirm in there that it's not impossible NQT tried to shut me down for asking inappropriately of the mod.

When he wanted CM as his top sus, EJ second, mine third and I pointed out to him that CM is the one with Eurogame and if town does for sure kill a maf - he then jumped to the idea if not elim her then elim me, my secrecy.

It feels pure scum in there.  If they're all maf I'm not surprised.  They never genuinely doubted each other or doubted each others' lack of doubt; the tiniest hint and it looks performative.

Seeing sal's flip, they both appear to trust each other even more.

I don't like it.  I don't get it.  I feel like I am exploring a carefully designed scum chat '2', one where they were allowed to pull someone in or not.  They don't have to use it, they can prep it.

NJW and Sal barely spoke at all to each other.  NQT never questioned that.  NQT talked to Sal, talked to NJW.

I am sorry to misread, misunderstand, and not be able to untangle the threads.

I do like you, and I don't want to be an arse.

[Imp]

Imp

I'm not imagining it am I, NJW and Salvatore never converse in the duelist chat, it's always with me, right?

So, NQT.  You're pretty darn sure NJW is town.

Don't put words in my mouth. He's my #2 suspect! I literally said in my last post that there are good reasons to suspect him. That's not pretty darn sure at all!

given that I was talking about this.  Multiple times.  You talked about it too before there, I quoted from the Duelist chat.

For you to return to that idea.... as if it's a brand new one.  As if you don't believe your 'sight' of the idea.

And following it with a demand I don't put words in your mouth.

You flop from asking me to confirm... something I already said.  You didn't listen to me previously when I said it or to yourself when you said it, and then you slip into demands I don't 'put words in your mouth'.

And I just walk away.

I'm sorry.  You're town.  You're innocent.  I was not strong enough or skilled enough to town read you or understand you were drowning or whatever and needed town's help.

[Imp]

suspecting you of stochastic rolefishing.

Hey, questions more!

I get that stochastic is probability based, and fits a distribution curve; which may be standard or skewed.  it 'happens by chance', it could be defined by a random variable.

I wonder if stochastic rolefishing involves indirectly asking a bunch of people questions that together can reveal roles?

What differs that from scumhunting?  Or what am I doing or doing to your eyes?

[notquitethere]

You seemed to want other people to reveal information when you yourself were determined not to reveal anything. This isn't necessarily scummy— everyone wants info — but it makes a stark contrast with your later admonishments to players not to claim so much.