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[zilpin]

I bought the Steam version, and love the new tile graphics, it is a great addition, welcome the new modding system, and no longer requiring manually editing text files for settings &c (although I still will).

...but...

1) Why can't I see embark details on the embark screen?
2) Why can't I set individual labors in a dwarf's labor screen anymore?
3) Why can't I make just an up stair or down stair anymore?  I used walkways made of downstairs all the time.
4) When I dig into the cave layer from the top and get an up-down stair, why can't I construct stairs under it anymore?
5) And the big one.  Why can't I play without a mouse anymore?

The whole "work details" thing is nice and all, but I still want direct control over what each dwarf is doing at any time.
Is it even possible to make someone a dedicated mechanic and prevent anyone else from do a mechanic job now?

[Shonai_Dweller]

1) You...can? What details are you missing?
2) Because they decided micromanagement hell was not the way they wanted the new interface to be so you don't have to any more. They've talked about reintroducing some kind of detailed control for micromanagers. Problem is making sure it's hidden enough for people not to mistake it for the intended system, probably.
3) New system. Doesn't work as well as they thought it would. That's, you know, Dwarf Fortress development for you. Not unique to Steam release. Maybe it'll get improved later.
4) Same as 3
5) Because the keyboard controls haven't been added yet. They didn't take them away, the new interface is a mouse controlled interface. You can't "take something away" if it never existed (unless you mean the entire horrific old UI, in which case, well tough, removing that was the point of the the release).
When they add the keyboard controls, as they said they would, you'll have keyboard controls.

[Blue_Dwarf]

Is it even possible to make someone a dedicated mechanic and prevent anyone else from do a mechanic job now?

Yes, just make a custom labor that only has the mechanic labors, and set it to "only selected do this".

[freeze]

Maybe I’ll buy on steam when some of these are fixed.

[zilpin]

1) You...can? What details are you missing?

I cannot see where the different biomes overlap, or what the biomes are.  Only the totality of the selected area.  So I micromanage more, using site finder, then checking each block with a 1x1 embark to learn the layout.
But I still love that artificial 16x16 regions are gone.

2) Because they decided micromanagement hell was not the way they wanted the new interface to be so you don't have to any more. They've talked about reintroducing some kind of detailed control for micromanagers. Problem is making sure it's hidden enough for people not to mistake it for the intended system, probably.

The problem is that the need for micromanagement is still there.  If there were some universal Stonedwarf skill it would be fine, but there isn't.  You still have stonecrafters, masons, engravers, and mechanics, and they use different workshops.
Fishing and and fish cleaning are still different skills.
Removing micromanagement is great, iff you really remove it.

3) New system. Doesn't work as well as they thought it would. That's, you know, Dwarf Fortress development for you. Not unique to Steam release. Maybe it'll get improved later.

Yeah.  The Queen is dead.  Long live the Queen.  Maybe 0.50.x should have been named Chapter III.   

4) Same as 3

Same response as 2.  The need is still there.

5) Because the keyboard controls haven't been added yet. They didn't take them away, the new interface is a mouse controlled interface. You can't "take something away" if it never existed (unless you mean the entire horrific old UI, in which case, well tough, removing that was the point of the the release).
When they add the keyboard controls, as they said they would, you'll have keyboard controls.

Same response as 3.

Thank you for your detailed reply.  It is helpful.
I had very different expectations going in, and the steam workshop support is great, though I haven't done anything with it yet.

[Quietust]

My impression is that, in order for Dwarf Fortress to appeal to the massive number of users on Steam, certain parts of it had to be dramatically simplified (some might say "dumbed down") - by comparison, the Bay12 community is quite small and grows much more slowly because of the rather high barrier to entry (i.e. being able to wrap one's head around the old version's UI).

Unfortunately, those changes have clearly alienated some of the original players who were accustomed to the old interface. Indeed, I personally find the current version to be unplayable because my 13+ years of muscle memory actively fight against me. It doesn't help that I also think mouse-based interfaces are clumsy and inefficient (because I have to slow down and actively watch what I'm clicking on, especially since there isn't a clear grid for keeping things aligned).

Hopefully, the game will evolve further to accomodate the old power-users, but I fear it may take a long time.

[zilpin]

I totally get that.  Need to appeal to beginners who walk away if they can't learn the whole game in 1hr.
Dwarf Fortress Learning Curve.
I'm sure you remember this meme:

https://i.stack.imgur.com/iECXl.jpg


Still, all the difficulty is still there.
E.g. soap is still put in the same place as coal and gold.
I wish they would've just made a new game with all the lessons learned.
Or "Dorf Daycare" or something.

[Salmeuk]

Zilpin, I highly recommend you download and install DFhack, available on the steam workshop. The utility solves many of the extant issues with material selection and smooths over many of the roughest edges. Hopefully, the DFhack labor manipulator will make a return - it was one of the most popular requests in the most recent poll on what to work towards next.

As well, there is always the good ol' Dwarf Therapist to fall back on if you need that specific control.

Because they decided micromanagement hell was not the way they wanted the new interface to be so you don't have to any more. They've talked about reintroducing some kind of detailed control for micromanagers. Problem is making sure it's hidden enough for people not to mistake it for the intended system, probably.

After much reflection, the new systems were indeed a step towards something new, and there is a lot of good improvements, but it was a step taken too lightly, and the resulting half-way point between "old hardcore ui" and the new interface is, frankly, a bit tough to swallow. either commit to removing all player control over dwarf labor, or just let us have actual control. Fortresses are just fantastical bureaucracies anyways, so why the hate for spreadsheets? Even Rimworld's interface (which obviously was referenced during the design process of DF premium UI) has a freaking spreadsheet. That's a game from 2013.

It is not micromanagement to want your characters to act according to your fantastical narrative, no? Is the only player being catered to the one who plays DF as a sort of "bad Factorio", the hyper-industrialist whose dwarves are mere peons used to produce, and thus has no interest in the individual units activities?

There is a community of storywriters and roleplayers who need this "micromanagement" to properly utilize the game systems to their ends. Regardless of the efficiency of said labor assignment process . . it's a useful tool.

premium asked a LOT from old players: learn a new, still-complicated, and slower interface - not see much in the way of actual gameplay updates - and pay money for the privilege.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I paid for four copies of the game for friends and myself. I will always support the development of DF - how could I not ? but I just think there is a disconnect here, between community and devs.

All in all, I %100 agree with OP and will continue to voice this opinion respectfully despite certain attempts to shut down this discussion.