Marooned in Morrowind ---> MiM ---> Morrowind is Magic
I actually hadn't noticed that. But, as mentioned when this MST3K started, this game turned up a
lot of Jungian synchronicities. Which, again...is to be expected, given the premise. For example, I remember being pretty surprised when I noticed that the Imperial legion armor depicts
silver and gold horses facing each other. That whole thing about
Wingless Twilight's being the servants of Azura/Celestia, I think I first noticed that when I was looking up Azura on UESP for some reason. I don't remember when that was, exactly, but I think not until the game was established. In fact, when I started I hadn't exactly even thought out the Celestia/Azura connection very much. It was more of an intuitive 'aha!' I am of course,
not the only person to have made that connection, and if you'll recall, at the beginning on MLP, Celestia was handling the job of raising both the sun and the moon just like Azura is shown to be
handling them both at her shrine. There were definitely some surprises, even for me. For example, if you'll forgive a bit of a tangent...
Celestia and Luna are obviously a classical sun/moon divinity pair, just like is ubiquitous in mythologies worldwide. It can be debated whether Faust
intended it, but it's incredibly obvious to anyone who's paying attention. I've occasionally wondered whether it was a case of
Tvtropes: Getting Crap Past the Radar, and
feminist Faust was deliberately slipping female goddess emperors past the censors, or whether she genuinely had no idea what she was doing.
But, I mean...seriously, when you introduce your characters by sticking them on top of a religious symbol:
...and then associate those characters with the same things traditionally associated with that same symbol:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yin_and_yang"...yin and yang combine the same "hill" radical 阝 with the non-phonetic yue 月 "moon" and ri 日 "sun", graphically denoting "shady side of a hill" and "sunny side of a hill". Compare the Classical Chinese names (which contain tai 太 "great") for these two heavenly bodies: Taiyin 太陰 "moon" and Taiyang 太陽 "sun"."...and when you then name one of those characters after the goddess associated with the exact same thing you're associating your character with:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luna_(goddess)"Luna is the divine embodiment of the Moon"(Remember that Luna was the mare....
in the moon, not "on" the moon.)
...and name the other character after a word that means:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/celestial"pertaining to the spiritual or invisible heaven; heavenly; divine:...and you then have other characters in that universe engage in referential humor depicting those characters in the role of god, as for example, as shown by the infamous
Rarity 'As Celestia is my witness scene, and duplicated
here by Fluttershy. Which for those who don't get the reference, this is straight of the bible:
Romans 1-9"For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers;"Corinthians 1-23"I call God as my witness--and I stake my life on it"Thessalonians 2-5"God is our witness"Or, as others might more easily recognize from the
Scarlet o'Hara 'God is my witness' scene from Gone with the Wind.
There's so much of this stuff going on in first season MLP before Faust was booted from the show and her replacement started retconning it, I kind of have a hard time believing that nobody knew what was going on and that it was all just a coincidence.
Anyway, point of that tangent being that Celestia is clearly a sun goddess. But Azura is the daedra of the "
dusk and the dawn," not
just the dawn. When I first started out, I hadn't quite reconciled how that matched. But then I realized that yes, their spheres are actually the same: Celestia raises the sun, but she also
lowers it. Dusk and dawn are both her time, just like Azura.
At one point I remember going and checking UESP to find out which daedra was Luna. Because at that point my thinking was "well,
obviously there's going to be one." And sure enough, she's Nocturnal:
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Nocturnal"Nocturnal, who is also known as the Night Mistress, the Mistress of Shadows, The Unknowable,Empress of Murk, Daughter of Twilight"Ok, so there's Luna. But...
wait a second "Daughter of Twilight?" Twilight Sparkle? What's
that about?
: " What about Nocturnal, or shall I say Nyx, who you ironically haven't even met? Mary Sue like her can't stand the competition, I suppose. Or maybe the incestuous implications if she were to appear.
Self-involvedicus Maximus? He's foreign, too. And much more of an influence. In fact, in about twenty minutes he's going to be the unknowing instrument for the biggest change this world has seen since Selene decided it wouldn't be entirely terrible if she wasn't the only one playing with herself."
Nocturnal is known in Tamriel as a Daedric Prince known as the Night Mistress, Mistress of Shadows, and other things; much the same way Sheogorath is the Daedric Prince of Madness (and occasionally cheese, for some reason.) I'm not sure who Nyx is in this case, but I've heard the name in connection to the night in other cultures. This is likely another multi-entity not unlike Sheogorath or Vivec. But since Sheoggy mentioned "Mary Sue" I'm put in mind of SexyWithers. I know the consensus (such as there is) has it that she's Luna - which kind of fits, she's the main night-themed figure for the ponies, with some sway over dreams as well
Nocturnal and Nyx, both linked to darkness, but somewhat different all the same.
I recall Nyx being the name of a character from a really famous mlpfim fan fiction I never read. I don't know much about it, but I think I've inferred that it might involve twilight raising a tiny baby demon? Anyway, I think I also heard about Nyx being a boring maybe Mary Sue character though I don't know for sure again.
...yes, actually. That story would be
Past Sins, one of the more famous stories in the fandom. In which Twilight Sparkle's blood is used in a spell to reincarnate Nightmare Moon (Luna) into a new body and then she
raises her as her daughter.
I was of course familiar with Past Sins. I read it back when it was new. But seeing for the first time on UESP that line about Nocturnal being the 'Daughter of Twilight,' that was a bit of a jolt. Sychronicities like this happened pretty regularly.
Anyway, Sheogorath's comment about incest was making a pun. In Equestria-universe, originally Luna was the only one playing the game/spell. She was therefore "
playing with herself." But like every other tomato, Nyx/Nocturnal are basically the same entity as seen from different universes. As clearly implied by Sheogorath:
: "Nocturnal, or shall I say Nyx
In Equestria-universe, Luna and Nightmare Moon are (more or less) the same pony. (It's debatable. Some theories suggest that Nightmare Moon was simply Luna having a bad day. Other theories suggest that 'the Nightmare' was an external entity that fused with Luna to become a singular entity, Nightmare Moon. Obviously, of course, given infinite universes, there are universes where either interpretation is correct.)
In omniverse, Celestia and Azura are components of the same hyperentity. In omniverse, Luna and Nocturnal are the same entity. But,
in Equestria-universe, Nyx is a pony. And Nyx (Twilight's daughter) is the reincarnation of Nightmare Moon...who is (kind of) Luna.
So what would happen if Nyx (in Equestria) started playing the game?
Luna and Nyx would be "playing with each other."
https://www.google.com/#q=defintion+incest"sexual relations between people classed as being too closely related to marry each other."
:
"Pretty sure your own reincarnation could be considered 'closely related.'":
"I'll have you know that a ziploc bag full of gouda shavings enjoyed that pun a grate deal. "
There was some other stuff I was going to comment, but it's almost 4am here.
: "I'd like to ask: why didn't you guys ever establish a base? That's something every player of Morrowind, pretty much ever, always does. They pick a place to put the extra loot they don't want to carry. And you had extra incentive to do it here, because alchemy tools turned out to be too big to carry. You had plenty of opportunity. Why did you guys never pick a place and call it home?"