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Author Topic: No migrants, no babies... Pop Cap looks okay  (Read 571 times)

Corambis

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No migrants, no babies... Pop Cap looks okay
« on: May 11, 2015, 01:57:21 pm »

I haven't had an immigrants or any babies at my fort for years. I'm on the latest version using the Lazy Newb pack. I've checked the d_Init file or whichever it was and confirmed that the population cap lines were in there. I've tried adjusting them to higher numbers, but it never seems to help. Animals still have babies. I became a barony just to get more migrants, but so far they haven't shown up. But it's been less than a year. I did have Fun, but all the clowns were escorted from the premises. My fort has to be worth a ton of money. I've search through the wiki, these boards, and the Reddit Sub, but no luck. Does anyone have any suggestions? My dwarves are slowly getting depleted over time from accidents, unwelcome visitors, etc.
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PatrikLundell

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Re: No migrants, no babies... Pop Cap looks okay
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2015, 03:00:59 pm »

Well, dwarf depletion is one factor that decreases the attraction of a fortress. Invasions will also block immigration that season of the invaders are still present when they should appear. As far as I understand, one of the most important immigration factors is the amount of wealth exported. Since wealth is reported by dwarven caravans successfully leaving your map, ensuring their safety is of importance as well.
If you're using the Lazy Newb Pack as you state, the pack's startup console provide two pop cap numbers (should be the same as the ones in the init file), where pop cap controls the cutoff for immigration and strict pop cap cuts immigration as well as pregnancy.
I don't know what happens if you turtle while immigrants are due to arrive, but that might cause them to give up before entering the map.

Lack of immigrants can behave in two ways:
1. A message appearing stating that there were no immigrants this season. This means an immigration event was triggered (thus the pop cap isn't the problem), but the evaluation came up with zero because your fortress is too unattractive.
2. No message at all throughout the season, and no invasions to block immigration. If the season is any other than winter, a pop cap block ought to be in play.
3? It may or may not be the case that the death of you civ (outside of your fortress) could result in a cessation of immigration. However, I've had several fortresses that were based on dead/dying civs that still received immigrations to fill the quota. Dead/dying is warned against on embark, and also shows by a royal appointing itself in your fortress. If all the eligible emigration sites are besieged they might be unable to emigration as well.

When it comes to baby generation I can't help, since my fortresses all suffer from a significant procreational impotency.
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Eldin00

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Re: No migrants, no babies... Pop Cap looks okay
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2015, 04:45:41 pm »

Nothing to add to what's already been said on the subject of immigration. But as to births, in addition to the population caps, there's a setting of [BABY_CHILD_CAP:num:pct] in the init files, which prevents new pregnancies if the number of babies+children in the fortress >= num or the percentage of your citizens who are children or babies >= pct.
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Corambis

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Re: No migrants, no babies... Pop Cap looks okay
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2015, 09:33:30 pm »

All of the caravans have made it off the map, I believe. I've had some turn around before they made it to my fortress because a corpse spooked them or something. I don't know if some deaths I had from the Fun scared them off. The lack of births recently has me confused as well. I'm probably missing something simple. I do have a ton of animals that I am in the process of slaughtering. I don't know if that somehow impacts things. But it doesn't stop them from having babies left and right. Maybe it's a DFHack thing or something. But here's the lines from my d_init file. I've tried all kinds of differing values in there, setting the cap as high as 300, with no luck.

Code: [Select]
[POPULATION_CAP:190]
[STRICT_POPULATION_CAP:195]

[BABY_CHILD_CAP:100:50]
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PatrikLundell

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Re: No migrants, no babies... Pop Cap looks okay
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2015, 03:19:31 am »

Spooked caravans are not good, because the goods they drop when fleeing is considered confiscated by you, although I don't know if that impacts immigration. Corpses should be hauled out of sight of caravans and dorfs alike.
The number of animals affects birth at an enormous number I think (something like 30000). I think there is a maximum creature number to that effect (bees are not included!).
That's not likely to be it, however.

My gathered info on child making (as stated earlier, I've failed miserably myself, so beware!):
- Couples have to be at adjacent tiles to generate a pregnancy, so keeping the partners apart will ensure there won't be any. It might be possible to help pregnancies along by relieving couples of all duties and assign them to a barrow consisting of their bedroom for a while, and then releasing them after having observed them adjacent to each other.
- Some dorfs are not interested in children, and so, won't generate any, even though they may form a couple.
- Some dorfs are homo- or bi-sexual, and like-gendered couples obviously won't have children.
[I don't really have the issues above, since I fail before that is possible, as my dorfs don't make friends]
- Dorf relationship go through friend->lover->couple (with passing acquaintance and friendly relation before that)
- Once friends, dorfs throw parties. I suspect those increase the friendships and help create lover couples, but I've got no real info on that. It might also be that parties might generate friendships between dorfs who are friends with the organizer but not each other (another speculation), but I've had dorfs who have grudges towards each other party with a mutual friend without any change in their relation.
- I've gotten the advice that relations are improved if the dining room configuration has four chairs in a square with a table outside of each chair (i.e. one table per chair), since eating dorfs are supposed to chat with dorfs sitting adjacent to them.
- I think I've found that my mega size dining room/meeting hall was a mistake, since shrinking it means idle dorfs mill about in a smaller area, and thus are more likely to be adjacent to other dorfs, and thus presumably might strike up a conversation. I haven't seen any improvement to the friend situation since I changed it, though.
- Idle dorfs are supposed to chat with adjacent dorfs, so keeping a light work load in the fortress might help foster friendships. My attempts at that haven't produced any visible results (well, most dorfs have passing acquantance or friendly relations with each other, but not past that).

Animals have been changed to require to be adjacent to each other for impregnation to happen (i.e. same rules as for dorfs), which typically happens automatically on pastures. Caged animals cannot get impregnated, but if caught when pregnant will give birth in the cage (and the offspring are NOT automatically assigned to the cage, as a couple of incidents with roaming partially trained GCS' have shown). It used to be that animals could get impregnated by other animals right across the map.
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