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[Toady One]

A new Threetoe story.

[Fourth Triad]

Fun story. I like the idea of enemies getting resurrected so you can kill them again.

[Tormy]

Yeah.  
It is also fun to read the analysis. There are lot of decent ideas in that part, what should be in the game someday.   :cool:

[Little]

I like your stories, Three Toed.

I really like Evil Philosopher.

[TotalPigeon]

Threetoe, you really really need to write a long story. I'd buy it.

[puke]

first, i love Three Toe's stories.  Theyre some of my favorites.  I have some observations on this one that I hope are constructive.  I'm not trying to be an over-critical anonymous forum asshole, i just want to constructively discuss this story, because i enjoyed it and i have some comments on it.

this was a good one, but it felt too short.  i liked how it jumped in, kinda in-media-res, but there was a lot going on that felt like it needed back story.

i mean, we can imagine it or make it up ourselves, but there were a lot of things that left me wanting explinations.  for example:

- The deposed queen is a combat badass
- she is friends with officers in the guard, but not so much that they'd stay loyal to her
- the usurper managed to sway the entire guard / army to his side, though they seemed willing enough to go back once he was dead.
- super whip user! i got a real "fist of the north star" feel when he was cracking pavement stones with the whip!  also when the queen was kicking ass.  these are clearly mythical / magical / super level badasses here. that is okay, i just didnt see it coming.

one thing that bothers me about alot of fantasy (i was really grinding my teeth through Shrek 3) is how fickle guards are.  they'll readily help the evil usurper overthrow the good ruler, and will turn against their own citizens.  well, where did those guards come from?  didnt they grow up in that town?  doesnt their mother still live there?  dont they know the new guy is an asshole?  Even in Lord of the Rings.  Why the fuck didn't one of the Rohirim knock wormtongues block off?  They all knew he was a dick, thats why they gave him that nickname!  The king wouldnt have even noticed if he turned up dead one day.

I've read a fair few Three Toe stories, and these kinds of things are not usually problems in them.  In fact, I remember one where it directly addressed some of this, about small town guards and a change of policy.  Its not that I think there are holes in the story, its that i think there are some things that could be explained better.

This would work great as a middle part or even first part of a longer story. but as a short story, i think it could be better.  For example, the guards were probably raised from another region, or are mercinaries, or are on loan from a neighboring kingdom that stands to benefit from the change in rulership.  There may have been a propoganda campaign or a systematic bribing of the lesser provincial leaders before the power swing.  there could be all sorts of things going on that we dont see.

thats part of the fun of a story that starts "in the middle of the action" -- but explaining them before the end of the story would really up the page count.  and not explaining them leads to problems.

i know this post is already way to long, but i guess i want to close by saying theres two kinds of people.  the kind that look at something and try to find holes in it and reasons why it wont work, and the kind that get excited by an idea and try to think of all the situations that could potentially make it work.

I like to think of myself in the second camp, and I dont mean to be complaining about the story, but i think it would be really cool if it was longer.

[ThreeToe]

It is already too much to ask that people read my stories.  Thank you all for that.  But it is like praise from heaven when people start thinking about my stories.  Criticism is very welcome.  I have a couple longer stories I'm working on right now.  I'm also trying to spit out at least one story a week.  But i have been served notice, and will not sacrifice quality for speed.

With this story I tried to stress the difference between good and evil and that evil would be defeated and punished.  This story was about half the length of the others.  I was going for something fast and brutal.  Of course, even when stories are short, they still have to make sense.  I felt this story was just consistent enough to send through.  I hope everyone enjoyed it.  Thanks for your analysis.

[Markavian]

Hey ThreeToe, I read and enjoyed the story.

puke, I agree with the points you made. Guards are normally minless servants who do what they're told, I would argue that loyalty is an uncommon strength.

How did Valdara end up in the dead wagon?

I think that creatures should have personality, e.g. "bloodlust" which affects their decisions. Valdara didn't just rip that guard's head off because she could; she probably enjoyed doing it, and like you said - it made a point of control. Your average legendary carpenter, having the strength of 100 men, although capable of severing a head from the body with their bare hands wouldn't necessarily take that action unless so inclined.

Processions could be formed around the 'target'. The chosen route would be bordered by onlookers trying to get close to the action. In a disorganised case, they could crowd en-masse. Most organised/respectfully they could line the streets. Thought: Funeral processions?

Regards,
- Markavian

[puke]

quote:Originally posted by Markavian:
<STRONG>How did Valdara end up in the dead wagon?</STRONG>

actually, i dont mind about that at all.  i dont want to invalidate or detract from your point (feel free to disagree with me), but this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_medias_res  is an effing-hard technique to master.  

and i think the opening of the story pulls it off perfectly.  i find myself not caring at all how she got into that wagon, because i can imagine a MILLION reasons how and why.  in a longer story, it might eventually become apperant through other facts that you can infer from, or flashbacks, or recaps, or any number of things.  I think theres something smooth... something chic about not explaining it.

its the other little things that piled up unexplained that had me scratching.

but i think you're right.  the "bloodlust" theme is very prevelant in this one.  you have the two sides of good and evil, but they are both very blood thirsty.  the guards butcher the civilians.  the queen wants to murder the usurper, and apeals to the bloodlust of the gods.  the crowd's bloodlust and sense of vengence spur her on.  Good and Evil, yes -- but the contrast is tuned dark.

also, while thinking about character motivations, i think i put my finger on the thing that i was unsure of.  and people are falible, dont get me wrong.  i dont know how many times ive watched a movie and someone has said "i cant believe they did that, thats so stupid!"  and i have responded "yeah, well, i can believe it.  people are generally pretty stupid."  so what im about to coment on might be totally intentional.  but here it is:

Captain Evans KNEW that the queen was going to hand him his ass.  but he was loyal enough to stick to his convictions and fight her anyway.  but he WANST loyal enough not to betray her in the first place.

On further analysis, this isnt really so bad.  maybe he had a general mistrust of female rulers.  maybe he realized that he had made one drastic choice, and now had to live with the consequences.  maybe dieing in combat was a subconsious way of atoning.  maybe lots of things.

i think thats the nature of short stories.  they leave lots of things up to you.  I think i like this one more, the more i think about it.  theres a high initial investment of thought required, so its not so good for someone who wants mindless pulp entertainment.  but i think its a good provocotave story in the end.

[Aaaamory]

Wow, I really enjoyed the story.  It started to get really interesting when Valdara was revealed to be carrying a very special ring.  It made some sense to me that she had superdwarf (superhuman?) combat skills, inside the context of the game she's probably one of the super tough dwarves with a legendary skill in wrestling.

I don't believe that there is any further explanation that is needed in the story.  I mean, when you're wandering around and you arrive at a location where something like this is occuring, it is still exciting to stop and witness it.  And we do get lots of information.  I felt like I knew enough "why" to be satisfied.