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[Saiko Kila]

I've noticed a certain problem with my tree farm. I've made a bunch of farms sized 51x31x5, deep underground but above first caverns. They are located between marshland biome and beach, i.e. ocean biome, in satellite view . Now, although the parts are indistinguishable after creating mud, the part deep under beach doesn't grow anything - trees, shrubs or moss. Normally that would be welcome, makes surroundings look cleaner. But in a tree farm it's problematic. Fortunately most of tree farms is under marsh, but I wonder how to make such things in biomes consisting mainly of ocean? I suppose obsidian tiles wouldn't change anything?

Or maybe it will grow after considerate time? I've looked into the caverns. There are trees under ocean, but no moss. There are very rare shrubs, but parts under marsh have much more shrubs. Besides, I don't know if the tiles with shrubs are not just incursions of marsh biome. And trees grow mostly out of water, which is impossible in a tree farm. Saplings die after some time in water, even if it's shallow.

[PDF urist master]

you need at least 2z levels of space for the trees to properly.

As long as there are underground shrubs, you should be able to grow trees. make such to use water to muddy the floor so moss can grow.

with your setup, you should be able to get trees to grow.

[Saiko Kila]

you need at least 2z levels of space for the trees to properly.

As long as there are underground shrubs, you should be able to grow trees. make such to use water to muddy the floor so moss can grow.

with your setup, you should be able to get trees to grow.

Problem is the trees (or shrubs and moss) don't grow on muddied floor, when it's under ocean. Well, so far. Muddied floors under other, neighbouring biomes, grow saplings. I suppose this is some property of ocean biomes. Maybe even a mistake in code somewhere.

[Sadrice]

Biomes do not respect depth or local conditions at different depths.  A biome is the same on all z levels.  This leads to a certain amount of oddness with underground growth being limited by what is possible on the surface (though not in all cases, caverns under deserts have normal vegetation, I believe).

[Saiko Kila]

I was suspecting this may be the case. After all, what is the difference between mudded diorite and it's neighbouring mudded diorite? Must be some biome thing. Like magic killing all vegetation. But I didn't know that ocean has some code preventing growth - because it really doesn't need one.

[Sadrice]

The code might be there to make it so beaches are barren and sandy.

[Saiko Kila]

Probably, but it could work only on surface.

[Dwarf4Explosives]

Yeah, I've noticed this sort of thing too. It's rather weird, all things considered. However, if you have drained the ocean (partially), or dug under it, you could set up an automated system to catch the larger creatures that spawn in the ocean. PM me if you're interested.

[Saiko Kila]

Yeah, I've noticed this sort of thing too. It's rather weird, all things considered. However, if you have drained the ocean (partially), or dug under it, you could set up an automated system to catch the larger creatures that spawn in the ocean. PM me if you're interested.

Technically I'm interested in catching big animals, and that's the primary reason I embarked near a beach. However, although the fort has about 6 years, I've never seen a big water animal. Or a small one. Never. Only vermin there. Well, there were giant albatrosses once, but I suppose they came because of neighbouring savage biome and just flew to the ocean to hang around... So unfortunately, no big catch for me. And yes, I'm disappointed. The ocean is kind of wasted space in my settlement.

[Dwarf4Explosives]

If you want ocean animals, I think you may need to kill of some of the wild land animals which may be taking up the creature slots the whales/dolphins/sharks/octopi/etc. need.

[Saiko Kila]

If you want ocean animals, I think you may need to kill of some of the wild land animals which may be taking up the creature slots the whales/dolphins/sharks/octopi/etc. need.

I hoped the slots were separate for different biomes. But most probably you are right. I was getting almost exclusively giant keas and giant crows, till one goblin siege forced giant crows over ocean, and they are stuck in the air and nothing new comes. I'm going to exterminate all giant keas (there are only about 1000 of them in the whole world, and I've captured or killed many of them), but there's no way to wipe out giant crow population (33 thousands).

But I will try. I suppose the best thing to do is to make a bridge over ocean, and send marksdwarves. Pity dwarves don't have boats or punts.

[Dwarf4Explosives]

Maybe you could train the keas and send them to attack the crows? I think that, if trained, the keas don't count as an animal slot anymore (unless you're unlucky enough to have another population pop up).

[Saiko Kila]

Maybe you could train the keas and send them to attack the crows? I think that, if trained, the keas don't count as an animal slot anymore (unless you're unlucky enough to have another population pop up).

After modding keas to be war trainable? I don't know if they will be willing, but I'll see. I tamed many giant keas, but they are very weak against goblins (they weight like 200 U, while for example giant louse brought by nice elves weights 3600+ U), and would be on par with giant crows. After military training they might fare better.