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Author Topic: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?  (Read 3415 times)

GavJ

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2014, 10:49:15 am »

So you are covering the "roof" with 1 tile wide, raised drawbridges? Ok, I misunderstood... I thought of building as many as neccessary 10x10 bridges.
? No, your original concept. As many as necessary 10x10 or whatever. But leaving them LOWERED, not raised. As appropriate for an actual roof.

I'm merely suggesting they take the role of floor panels, because they use far fewer resources and go up more quickly by far, thus limiting your vulnerability during construction.

Yes, but lowered bridges can be destroyed by building destroyers.

Where are you getting this information from? I have seen fire beasts melt them but never seen deconstruction. Wiki says immune to building destroyers as well
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Cauliflower Labs – Geologically realistic world generator devblog

Dwarf fortress in 50 words: You start with seven alcoholic, manic-depressive dwarves. You build a fortress in the wilderness where EVERYTHING tries to kill you, including your own dwarves. Usually, your chief imports are immigrants, beer, and optimism. Your chief exports are misery, limestone violins, forest fires, elf tallow soap, and carved kitten bone.

Thisfox

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2014, 03:38:36 pm »

... if you don't mind your fort entrance being a sea of vomit... blue everywhere!
HOW ARE YOUR DORFS MAKING BLUE VOMIT, WHAT ARE YOU FEEDING THEM?
I've been feeding them plump helmets and roasts? 
More seriously, I use Mayday's tileset, that may be why.  It's a deep blue too, so it's quite vivid.

I was laughing at this interaction, then checked my entrance. The top four levels of walkway are green, all the way to the top of the Aquifer Stairs. Oh. Right. That's happening here too. Seems odd though: Most of my dorfs have no reason to go out of the fort to be exposed to the daystar, the trade depot is underground, and the military have been training in daylight since year dot...

My problem is that I've now got the three levels of dining rooms (It took a while, and the water isn't "on" in the lowest levels, but we're getting there) so there's no way I can acclimate most of them to daylight: They never even venture as high as the upstairs dining area, which is still under nine levels of aquifer. There's no way I'm putting daylight in there... I guess this will keep on happening. Wish I could talk them into actually cleaning all that green up...
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Max™

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2014, 04:54:11 pm »

I once put forth the idea that the reason it is such a bright color is a sort of territorial marking.

Creepy fortresses with human and elf and dorf skulls on the walls, feral children lurking behind sections of inhuman architecture? Goblins, maybe with a side of demons mixed in.

Bunch of smelly stuck-up assholes in a lame treehouse? Treefuckers.

A section of mysteriously burned landscape adjacent to what can't possibly be a natural cave formation and littered with piles of melted copper and occasional outcroppings of bones? Hard to say for sure.

The same thing, except it is coated with bright green vomit? We can't stop here, this is dorf country.
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gunpowdertea

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #33 on: November 14, 2014, 01:45:03 am »

So you are covering the "roof" with 1 tile wide, raised drawbridges? Ok, I misunderstood... I thought of building as many as neccessary 10x10 bridges.
? No, your original concept. As many as necessary 10x10 or whatever. But leaving them LOWERED, not raised. As appropriate for an actual roof.

I'm merely suggesting they take the role of floor panels, because they use far fewer resources and go up more quickly by far, thus limiting your vulnerability during construction.

Yes, but lowered bridges can be destroyed by building destroyers.

Where are you getting this information from? I have seen fire beasts melt them but never seen deconstruction. Wiki says immune to building destroyers as well

The wiki says:
Quote
When activated, the bridge "raises" very quickly, [ ... ] The resulting wall is always one z-level tall, watertight, and invulnerable to building destroyers.
I had trolls, rampaging dwarves, titans and whatnot destroy lowered bridges... the only way lowered bridges are safe is when they are only accessible from below (like hatch covers).
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GavJ

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #34 on: November 14, 2014, 08:56:05 am »

The wiki also says:
Quote
The reduced material requirements make bridges a viable alternative to roofing it up tile by tile. While it'll still be immune to Building destroyers, a proper constructed ceiling is superior if you expect it to be exposed to extreme temperatures.

(which is not inconsistent with the other wiki quote -- it is saying it is safe from building destroyers up OR down).

Hot enough bodies passing over can melt it, which explains titans. Dwarves in your fort tantrumming have different rules than building destroyers, I believe, don't know about if they can break a bridge. (just don't let them onto your roof, though...).

Are you absolutely, 100% sure you have witnessed directly a troll walk up to a lowered bridge, stand there for awhile, with no other nearby threats, and it broke?
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Cauliflower Labs – Geologically realistic world generator devblog

Dwarf fortress in 50 words: You start with seven alcoholic, manic-depressive dwarves. You build a fortress in the wilderness where EVERYTHING tries to kill you, including your own dwarves. Usually, your chief imports are immigrants, beer, and optimism. Your chief exports are misery, limestone violins, forest fires, elf tallow soap, and carved kitten bone.

Max™

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #35 on: November 15, 2014, 12:24:21 am »

I've had a snail destroy a bridge... due to me trying to smash it and learning that when they say "giant snail", the "giant" part is what is important there.
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Arcvasti

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Re: "Jack in a box" fort - would this work?
« Reply #36 on: November 15, 2014, 12:34:43 am »

I've never seen a Bridge destroyed by a building destroyer, lowered or otherwise. They don't even seem to get targeted. They CAN, however, be destroyed by trying to raise or lower it on something exceeding a certain amount in size[Giant Snail, Titan, FB, Dragon,Elephant]. I think tantrumming dwarves might still be able to destroy it and dragonfire melts EVERYTHING[even adamantine] not made out of nethercap. The best solution to your problem. Is to build walls up 15 z-levels to the sky. Creatures spawn only at the edges of the map, so its perfectly safe, if costly in materials. Your first idea, of having bridges for a roof, works for everything except rocs and other flying large megabeasts, which will destroy and jam your bridges if they're in the way of them closing or opening.
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