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[GoblinCookie]

I keep observing the same basic problem.  Everytime I make a new game, it turns out that a large proportion of the nobility of my dwarf civilization are some variant of goblin judging by their proffession.  Sometimes even the king/queen.  I do not see elf, human, kobold etc nobles alongside them.

Why does this happen and can it not be sorted out!

[Scruiser]

Goblins are long lived and regularly at war.  During war, populations can be captured and turned.  After the war, the site can stay under control of the conquerors.  The conquered can still rise up socially.  Goblins at war more -> more goblins absorbed into dwarf society -> long lived goblins get noble positions.  To fix with modding... adjust human/elf ethics with to make them at war with dwarf's more, so then everyone can be conquered equally.

[cephalo]

immortal beings tend to eventually become rulers and stay rulers. In 34.11 it was vampires that led half the civs.

[GoblinCookie]

Goblins are long lived and regularly at war.  During war, populations can be captured and turned.  After the war, the site can stay under control of the conquerors.  The conquered can still rise up socially.  Goblins at war more -> more goblins absorbed into dwarf society -> long lived goblins get noble positions.  To fix with modding... adjust human/elf ethics with to make them at war with dwarf's more, so then everyone can be conquered equally.

They really need to have settlements transfer properly into the ownership of the goblin conquerers then.  If the problem is that goblins keep conquering settlements, why do the settlements not transfer to goblin ownership?

[inEQUALITY]

Goblins are long lived and regularly at war.  During war, populations can be captured and turned.  After the war, the site can stay under control of the conquerors.  The conquered can still rise up socially.  Goblins at war more -> more goblins absorbed into dwarf society -> long lived goblins get noble positions.  To fix with modding... adjust human/elf ethics with to make them at war with dwarf's more, so then everyone can be conquered equally.

They really need to have settlements transfer properly into the ownership of the goblin conquerers then.  If the problem is that goblins keep conquering settlements, why do the settlements not transfer to goblin ownership?

I think you got what he was saying backwards. He was saying gobbos went to war with dwarves more than humans or elves, dwarves then conquer goblins, absorb goblin populations, goblins who live long in dwarf societies can rise in rank.

[GoblinCookie]

I think you got what he was saying backwards. He was saying gobbos went to war with dwarves more than humans or elves, dwarves then conquer goblins, absorb goblin populations, goblins who live long in dwarf societies can rise in rank.

If so there are an aweful lot of goblins being conquered by dwarves.  Maybe goblins should be better able to resist dwarf invasions.

The other question is why goblins seem to be concentrated at such high levels.  If dwarves invade goblins, they would put dwarves in charge surely.  Why are said dwarves not keeping titles within the family?  Are the goblins murdering them and taking back their homes?

[Scruiser]

How long is your history?  Given just a hundred years, they could go to war, be at peace, and then the settled goblins could gradually rise up in rank.  The game is working as intended right now.  To really prevent this, the game needs a racism/specisim/classicist/tribalist mechanic. That way the dwarf's could stop the goblins from rising up socially due to "racial hatred from historical conflict" and similar thoughts/civilization choices.  Of course then you would get other bits of fun, like hillocks dwarfs rebelling against fortress dwarfs and inter-class hatred.

[HenAi]

That's one possible way to make this less common. Another one would be working on the succession mechanics, or rather on the way (noble) families build up.
If the king has a large enough number of relatives and the successor is preferentially chosen from them, that would stop outsiders from rising that far up the ranks unless the whole family dies out.

[GoblinCookie]

How long is your history?  Given just a hundred years, they could go to war, be at peace, and then the settled goblins could gradually rise up in rank.  The game is working as intended right now.  To really prevent this, the game needs a racism/specisim/classicist/tribalist mechanic. That way the dwarf's could stop the goblins from rising up socially due to "racial hatred from historical conflict" and similar thoughts/civilization choices.  Of course then you would get other bits of fun, like hillocks dwarfs rebelling against fortress dwarfs and inter-class hatred.

250 years, which is the default history length. 

That's one possible way to make this less common. Another one would be working on the succession mechanics, or rather on the way (noble) families build up.
If the king has a large enough number of relatives and the successor is preferentially chosen from them, that would stop outsiders from rising that far up the ranks unless the whole family dies out.

There is actually no reason why the dwarf nobility should be hereditery since that would imply a concept of private property, which they do not really have. 

If the number of noblemen that are goblins overall exceeds the total % of the population that are goblins then I guess there is no problem with that.  The crucial thing here is that there should not have ever got to be so many goblins to start with.   

Elves have the exact same problem with humans.  Humans curiously do not have an equivilant problem excepting how they end up ruled by necromancers and vampires.