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Author Topic: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts  (Read 1134 times)

Xvareon

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Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« on: January 10, 2014, 01:38:02 pm »

Yes, I could have searched. Yes, I could have called someone. Yes, I could have asked the counselor/person who handles this stuff at the College (though they'd also tell me stuff confusingly). But frankly, I just don't give a damn, so I'm asking straight from here. I'm asking as someone who doesn't know his head from his tail as far as College goes. I'm going to head to a 2-year institution soon to get my Associates in General Studies, and already I'm confronted with a new concept; being able to pick which classes I want to attend. And then they bring up this new thing called 'Credit Hours', which I know absolutely nothing about. There's too much information and new concepts to make sense of at once, and my brain is locking up. Sucks, too, because classes start in 3 days. I'm screwed unless I figure this out, so please help.

   1) What are 'Credit Hours' (CR), exactly? Are they merely a mark of credit that you've completed a class, or are they like a 'currency' you use to pay to attend classes? How do I get CR? When are they used? Why are they important? Everything, please. I'd rather not miss anything.

   2) Is there some kind of 'checklist' of things or materials (aside from textbooks) that any College student should know to do, or know to have on hand?

   3) Is there a set of things that I need to do every so often? Like, re-registering at the end of every semester, or something? I need to know so I won't be surprised by some procedure or whatever.

   4) Regarding the FAFSA/Pell Grant for students; can it only be given to students starting in the Spring semester? When it processes, where does the money actually go, and how quickly? Does it wind up in credit form somewhere, that I can use to pay for my tuition expenses?

   5) When and how do I pay for all this? Do I need to pay for each class immediately (or at least soon after)? Or can I simply accumulate them all, and pay the whole sum at the end of the semester?

Thanks so much.

nenjin

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2014, 02:01:33 pm »

1. Credit hours are indeed your record of completing courses. Most colleges require X credit hours in each of Y fields to satisfy your degree requirements. That might 12 CR's in History, 25 CR in your core curriculum, and 15 CRs in disciplines of your choice. It varies by degree what is required. Reading your degree requirements is a fundamental part of having a clue in college, because without knowing that, you don't know half of what you need to graduate. Talk to your academic adviser, they will spell this out for you.

2. Student ID. Parking/bus pass. Campus map until you know where you're going. Your schedule. And of course, money.

3. You have to re-register every semester for new classes. This the #1 place college students fuck up either through inattention or because of financial reasons. HAVE YOUR BILL PAYED DOWN BY THE TIME YOU NEED TO REGISTER OR PREPARE FOR HELL. The fastest way to piss away money in college is being late registering for classes, getting none of the ones you need and being forced to take non-essential classes so you qualify as a full-time student. Take this shit very seriously.

4. This is something you need to take the initiative to research for yourself. Relying on other people to answer these kinds of high level questions for you is a recipe for disaster. The information is out there, it's your responsibility to know it. Financial Aid Loan Officers are the only people I'd trust to at least know the procedure. (I don't necessarily trust them to deal with you straight.)

5. Bills are typically due at the end of every semester. So you pay down your bill prior to the end of the semester, so you have a zero balance as the new semester approaches and you need to register. Note: If you have a student "debit" card, you can and will shoot yourself in the foot by using it and not swiftly paying down your bill. Because all those trips to the food court go on the exact same bill as your classes and are due at the same time to avoid having your account suspended. You don't want a $7 sandwich you bought yesterday to be the reason you have to run across campus like a madman to get registered.

Quote
But frankly, I just don't give a damn, so I'm asking straight from here.

Friend, take it from me: change your attitude or don't go to college. Because if you're paying for it, you don't sound motivated enough to make it worth the cost. And if your family is paying for it, it sounds like they're about to dump a ton of money on someone who just doesn't give a fuck.

Own up to your college experience or pick a different path. Don't be one of the countless thousands of students who go without a clue, stay without a clue and graduate without a clue. Your money deserves better than that, your family's money deserves better than that, and the public's money deserves better than that.

There's nothing wrong with not going to college. I went because it was expected of me too. But I eventually decided I wanted to be there, wanted to learn.

If you really want to do this, take the time to talk to an academic advsior .Tell them you don't know shit about shit and they'll be more than willing to help you.

Bottomline: Take it seriously or GTFO.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 02:03:59 pm by nenjin »
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LeoLeonardoIII

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2014, 03:18:31 pm »

   1) What are 'Credit Hours' (CR)? Each class is worth some number of credits. It's a measure of the amount of time and effort it takes to complete the class and also its value in completing your degree. Your school probably has a minimum amount of credits you need to take each semester to qualify as "full time"; under that it's "part time". Your student aid may be dependent on being a "full time" student.

Also the price of your tuition is based on your total credits per semester. Credits tend to be expensive when you take few, inexpensive when you take many. For example, at one college you might pay $600 for 6 credits, or $1100 for 12 credits, or $1400 for 18 credits. Taking more credits in a semester will mean you end up spending less on your tuition. The down side is that you might not be able to keep up with all your class work, and getting classes that schedule together well is more challenging the more you add.


   2) Is there some kind of 'checklist' of things or materials (aside from textbooks) that any College student should know to do, or know to have on hand? As for textbooks, try to get the list of books as early as possible. Visit online and used booksellers to get the same edition cheaper than at the student bookstore. Ask the teacher if you can get away with using the previous edition, which is generally much more available. Don't count on it though. Many students try to sell each other books - look for those resources. Finally if you can't get your books otherwise, hit the student bookstore and try to get used books there. Only pay for new books at the bookstore as a last resort.

You will need to make absolutely certain you can get to college on time. You need to be able to complete your homework, which at the point probably requires your own computer if you don't want to spend all your days in the student computer center. You will be hauling around books, so you need a good two-strap backpack to ease the strain on your flesh and nerves.

Check the syllabus for each class for other materials you'll need. Every single class will have a syllabus. For example, some classes will give you tests which you need a preprinted sheet with bubbles called a Scan-Tron which is fed into a grading machine. They come in different colors but it's honestly the simplest thing you'll need to overcome in college.

Get enough sleep. Get enough nutrition. Have fun but don't let your partying ruin your academics.


   3) Is there a set of things that I need to do every so often? Like, re-registering at the end of every semester, or something? I need to know so I won't be surprised by some procedure or whatever.Every year you need to re-apply for federal student aid. You can also apply for scholarships which come up periodically, which is nice because it's just free money, usually tied to an essay or something. But don't count on getting it. You also need to sign up for classes.

Do everything as soon as you can do it. This is the most important thing in college; do not wait one moment to get something done.

Let's say you sign up for classes online using the school website. You will talk with registration and they will give you the PIN needed to get in, and a day and time that is the earliest you can sign up. You need to have the list of classes you want ready to go, and alternates just in case those are taken. You need to be logged in and ready to click "submit". And, try to do it a day earlier - maybe it will let you get away with it! The point is, you MUST get those classes and if you wait a day you might miss out.

Different groups of students are allowed to sign up at different times. At one college I attended, the very first people to sign up were the ones with a lot of credits already (so it would be harder for them to accept an alternate class if it were full), then students who were still in high school, then veterans / disabled, then everyone else in order of how many credits they had already taken. A fresh adult student would register last, finding everything quite full.

If you see your class is full, and the "wait list" is only a few students long, register anyway. Show up on DAY 1 and attend every class. Make it clear that you want this class, you NEED this class. Invariably a couple students will drop the class a week in and people from the waitlist bump in, in order they signed up. But some of the people who signed up ahead of you will have dropped also in favor of getting into some other class. I'd say if the class holds 30, register as long as the waitlist is no more than 4 people already.

As for scheduling classes, your criteria is as follows: (1) the class must be in your degree program, (2) take your electives only if you have to, preferably taking them last, (3) take prerequisite classes early on (like if you know you'll need English 101 and 102, get 101 out of the way soon), (4) try to take classes that come in a series sequentially (so take Math 101 in Fall, Math 103 in Winter, Math 107 in Spring), (5) only retake a class if you must, a perfect GPA is less important than your finances and your standing with financial aid, which may require something like a 2.5 average to maintain your eligibility.

Remember that some classes have strange prerequisites - for example, you may need a certain math class before your hard science. Try to have this planned out as much as possible, but be willing to change your plan if you need to, just to get through this. You're getting a transferable associates' degree, which is a great idea, but don't be too worried if you had your heart set on Astronomy but you ended up having to take Chemistry instead.

To explain why you want to schedule your classes this way, imagine what you might be looking at when you're one semester away from graduating and you didn't listen. You need five classes, two of which have to be taken one after the other, and one of the others isn't even offered this semester. It's been forever since you did Math and now you're rusty, so one of these classes is gonna be a bitch to get through. And they're all 5-credit "big" classes, ones everyone else wants, because you spent all your electives early on. You need at least one extra semester to graduate. You also need to take 15 credits now and 10 credits next semester - but that puts you in "part time" for student loans. Either you take another 3-credit class to put you over, which doesn't matter to you and represents extra work and maybe $300 more in student loan debt, or you get a reduced student loan award and need to come up with the rest of the tuition money yourself. 

Contrast with someone who does it right: you're at the end of your degree with one semester to go. You need 12 credits, which ends up being two 5-credit "big" classes and one 3-credit "easy" one. But your two big classes are Astronomy and Creative Writing, and your easy class is Technology in the Modern World, an elective. The reading for Creative Writing is enjoyable, you just did a Math 107 so the piddly math in Astronomy is a breeze, and the elective is a Mickey Mouse class altogether. You spend most of your time in leisure enjoying fine whiskey and blowjobs.


   4) Regarding the FAFSA/Pell Grant for students; can it only be given to students starting in the Spring semester? When it processes, where does the money actually go, and how quickly? Does it wind up in credit form somewhere, that I can use to pay for my tuition expenses? Get a solid explanation from your financial aid department. You need to sign up as soon as possible, because there's a processing wait before you are eligible to receive funds. After that wait, and you are eligible, there's a delay before funds for any college semester are disbursed.

You will get a letter from FAFSA called a Master Promissory Note. Follow its instructions. You may be eligible for additional funds for living expenses in addition to tuition: it's a good loan, for a lot of reasons, but if you're gonna spend the money frivolously don't take the extra to do it. Just take enough for your tuition, fees, textbooks and supplies, etc. But don't be afraid to accept the extra; again, it's probably the best loan terms you'll ever receive. And it's better to have that extra couple hundred bucks in the bank for emergencies and then have more to pay off later.

You generally get an award letter for each semester in the mail. Follow its instructions to accept the award. After a delay, the bank will pay your college for tuition and fees, and the remainder gets deposited in your bank account. I think you might be able to get the remainder mailed as a check? Just get a bank account and have it auto-deposit if you can.

The college knows how tough it is to get your funding to come through on time. It's a huge hassle every semester. So there's a grace period before they demand payment. It usually won't come up unless you applied for funding too late, but even then there's some leeway. Again, talk with your financial aid counselor.

If your financial aid has a problem (your GPA is below C average or whatever they want, or you have too few credits that semester, or you have taken too many credits (possibly because you took classes outside your degree program or had to retake classes), you will be given a warning and/or put on suspension. You can wriggle your way out of this but it's tough and you can only get away with it a limited number of times.

Also, and I assume you did this already, you will need to apply for enrollment at your college. On your FAFSA you list which colleges you might attend; list any you're the least bit interested in just in case you don't get into your first pick. Apply for college early; you should be able to apply for enrollment during the previous year and explain that you want to start next Fall.


   5) When and how do I pay for all this? Do I need to pay for each class immediately (or at least soon after)? Or can I simply accumulate them all, and pay the whole sum at the end of the semester?As I described above, there is a date by which you must pay. You need to pay for all your classes and fees at the same time, each semester. Try to pay as soon as you can.

The college probably has a schedule of refunds, so if you attend the class for X days you can still drop the class and get your tuition refunded. This is dangerous because you need to remain above your "full time" credit load to maintain financial aid.

As for how you pay your loans: some of your loans will be subsidized, which means they have 0% interest rate. Others are unsubsidized, meaning they have the full, but very low, interest rate of like 2%. This interest is added to your loans while you're in deferment (which means you aren't paying them off yet) which is that compound interest. You take some of each; don't worry about the interest.

You remain in deferment as long as you are in school - possibly only as long as you're full-time. After you leave school you will try to get a job. Maybe you can't! You can apply for another deferment from the lender or whoever is servicing the loan. There is a limit to how many deferments you can get though. Don't let your loan slip into default by ignoring it and not apply for those deferments. Just make the calls, tell them you can't pay because you're unemployed or underemployed, whatever, and pay once you get a good job and you have your feet under you.

And don't worry about paying it off ASAP. Just pay the minimum unless you're flush with cash, at which point pay the amount they suggest and hope you pay. As debt goes, student loans are really friendly.

However, DO NOT REFINANCE. DO NOT GET A BANK LOAN. Refinancing a student loan changes it from a friendly, low-interest, deferable, student loan to a nasty, variable-interest, must-pay-now, standard loan. Like you get directly from a bank. Refinancing is never a good choice, I don't care what anybody says. Those re-fi places are just out to make money off of you, to your detriment.


//General Advice


Generally you want to get your books ASAP because the cheapest ones sell first. However sometimes a teacher has a different book than was used last semester, or even changes his mind after the syllabus is printed and scanned online. Talk with your teacher early on before classes begin and find out what the books will be. You usually can't return your books to the bookstore, although their policy may allow it very early on and if you haven't broken open the wrapping or separated any extra components. The book buyback at the end of the semester is a joke, they give you a pittance, so try to sell your books to other students. In fact, GIVE your books away rather than letting the bookstore profit more; hopefully there's a climate of mutual support and students will be willing to give you books to.

For that reason, and many others, get together with other students who are also in your program. This is more important for programs like nursing or paralegal because they're more focused and have more rigid class requirements. For example, a required class for them may be offered only once per year, and if you don't plan your whole degree program out you're screwed. As a generalist you're spared that, although certain bottleneck classes like English 101 and Math 101 are required by so many people that they fill up quickly. I've covered that under prerequisites above.

Congregating with students is also a good way to find out about bad professors and tough classes, and hear news about changes in the school. And it's just a fundamental part of college life to make a ton of friends and acquaintances. It may be helpful to set up an agreement with a classmate that if one of you is absent, the other will type up and email his notes.

Don't take classes of the same type concurrently. For example, don't take two PE classes in the same semester. You'll be tired and unable to perform well in either. Taking Math 101 and Math 103 at the same time, even if you can get the allowance to do it, is a bad idea because Math 103 assumes you know all the stuff from Math 101.

You can challenge classes, which means you just take a special final exam and get the credit without buying the book or spending the in-class time. Do this only if you absolutely know the material. And I mean, if you browse through the appendix and none of the terminology is unknown to you, and you skim the chapter intros and you could lecture on those topics. I've never challenged a class. Also look at it this way: you're still paying full tuition for the class, so you might as well get the instruction and writing practice out of it. Then again, if it really is just a boneheaded class for you, and attendance would be a waste of your time, challenging may be a good thing.

Look over your syllabi and see what the scoring method is. You generally get point for attendance, maybe 10%, so it's very worth your while to attend every single day. Attendance also means you're listening to lecture and taking notes actively, which helps you learn. Couple that with doing all you assigned reading, which improves your reading speed and comprehension, and you will be a rockstar and ace that bastard.

Another thing that will maximize your grades (and keep you in good standing with financial aid) is doing your homework as early as possible. If you have free time, get started on the next set of reading or test yourself with the end-of-chapter questions and terminology your teacher probably isn't using. You need to be able to turn in your work before your teacher expects it, so that when you flub it and skip a couple days of homework, you're just turning it in on time. If you shoot for the actual due date, when you flub it, you'll turn it in late and get docked points.

When writing, make sure you completely finish a whole day before it's due at minimum. You're going to write that night, go to sleep, and in the morning print out the work. Read it and correct it during the day. Then when you get home, revise and print again to turn in tomorrow. The fresh eyes on the work will prevent you from making some hilarious mistakes in your writing. I've done some crazy stuff - repeated whole paragraphs, said ridiculous things that make no sense, change from one argument position to another midway, forget parts of the paper, etc. And of course, printing it the night before heads off problems you will encounter with printer jams, running out of ink or paper, etc. If it won't print that night, you can still run out to a print shop right away or early in the morning. Also the campus almost certainly has print facilities though they charge just as much so it's more about convenience.

If you take online or hybrid classes, it's important to keep up with your work. Post as soon as you can, after finishing your reading. You probably have to post responses to others which makes it look like a discussion is going on: reply ASAP. Generally the people who post first have the greatest range of unsaid stuff to post about, and the people who post first say interesting things that are easy to reply to substantively. By shifting your due date for posting one day early you make your life MUCH easier. And you're not doing more work, it's just that the whole semester's due dates are a day early.

If you're lagging in a class, focus down on it. It's better to get three Bs than to get two As and a D. Stop doing your leisure stuff, stop wasting time with whatever, and set aside time to catch up on the reading and do the late work. If you turn in late work your professor will probably give you at least some points. Ask about extra credit you can do. Explain that you know you're lagging behind and you want to turn it around. You don't need to give a sob story to the teacher - they get enough of that from everyone else looking for a break - just make it clear you want to work hard and fix the problem. They will appreciate it!
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 03:37:14 pm by LeoLeonardoIII »
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Xvareon

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2014, 03:40:54 pm »

Thank you for being upfront and sincere with me. You're right; I do need to take this more seriously, 'cause my heart isn't fully in it right now. I really need to re-evaluate my priorities and decide what I want to do.

And thanks alot for clearing up those questions I had. I had talked to my academic adviser about it, actually, but there was so much other stuff to memorize at the same time that the specifics kinda got blurry (especially about CR's). You've all been very helpful.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2014, 09:14:17 pm by Xvareon »
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nenjin

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2014, 03:54:50 pm »

FWIW, after high school I *knew* my head wasn't in the right place for college. I was worn out, already tired of the system and wanting some freedom. I took two years and worked jobs until it kind of settled in that, hey, I could do this for the rest of my life if I didn't make the choice to do something more.

I'll repeat the wisest thing I ever heard in college, said in the last college thread: You get out of it what you put into it. If you're not really ready or willing to put anything into it, why go now?

And I don't say this like I made some great successful of myself in college. I did pretty mediocre. (Read as: average for average American college students.) But it wasn't really about becoming super successful. It was about owning the experience and giving it (and by extension, my family and myself) the respect it deserved. College in some ways is a joke for a lot of people, but it's entirely in your hands to shape what you do there and what you eventually get out of it. The responsibility for making choices and doing stuff is unpleasant but it's the prep course for being an adult. My degree? Meh. It's the piece of paper that says I put in the time, the sweat and the money. Little else. Doesn't mean you have to treat your degree the same way.

Quote
The reading for Creative Writing is enjoyable, you just did a Math 107 so the piddly math in Astronomy is a breeze, and the elective is a Mickey Mouse class altogether. You spend most of your time in leisure enjoying fine whiskey and blowjobs.

LIES! There were neither fine spirits nor hummers in my senior creative writing class!

Leo gives a solid plan of attack. And I guess his post reminds me....

Stepping back from all the drama of school, it's actually a great place to just learn cool shit. If you do the bare minimum for your degree and don't mind spending some money, you can learn some interesting things from knowledgable people in their field. I took all the humanities and soft sciences, Soc, Anthro, just for fun. Some of them even up to the graduate level (which pissed graduate students off ssoooooooo bad that someone not in their major was in their classes and pulling their weight.) I took a lot of history classes. Everything from pre-classical Art History and Greek Mythology, European History from the Dark Ages through WWII, to East Asian studies. Some of it met my requirements, some of it I did just for me. I'm just mad all the courses on ancient religion were always filled within 15 minutes of registration opening.

If you can get your schedule nailed down, get your college life aligned so you're not constantly trying to put out academic fires, there's a lot of joy to be had being a "professional student." I was lucky enough to have the resources to take classes like that outside of graduating, for which I'm very grateful. Otherwise college would have been a horrid, intellectually unstimulating bore.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 04:07:09 pm by nenjin »
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LeoLeonardoIII

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2014, 05:59:56 pm »

There is something to being a professional student. If you can discover ways to remain in college forever, your loans remain in deferment forever. If you get hired by a college you are typically able to attend classes at a greatly reduced price, meaning even after you get your PHD and start working you still don't have to pay them off. At some point you die and the debt is dispelled.

Oh BTW, I didn't mention it before and it's only tangentially relevant, but when you file for bankruptcy you can't escape your student loan debt. That's pretty much the only downside to an otherwise amazing opportunity that student loans represent.
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wierd

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2014, 01:24:59 am »

When I attended, I tried to find ways to ensure that I never incurred debt.

Used books, (and books from "freecycle" type mailing lists), student assistanceships, student TA position pay, and things of that nature.

I DID NOT live in the dorm. You have no idea how hard I had to fight admissions on that. I lived in town, lived in my own house, and drove.  The costs of gas were far cheaper than student housing.

I did not join any fraternities, and used my time doing the above things when I wasn't in class, or doing homework. 

As leo pointed out, working on campus often results in reduced tuitions. This is NOT TRIVIAL. You can get lab fees, and materials fees waived in classes for hard sciences, and can get directly discounted tuition on classes in other areas by working on campus, or being a TA. Over the course of the degree, you can cut the gross costs by half doing this.

In addition, being a TA will put you into a position where, if you are any good at your classes, you will be interacting with lots of students who are struggling with the material, and this is a good entreprenurial opportunity. Private tutoring, if you have the time, can seriously offset additional costs in the tuition.

General advice:

Beg, borrow, steal, or murder whoever you need to to get the updated list of available courses for the upcomming semester early, fill out all the requisite forms, and have your debts paid off in advance. Waiting even a single day after admission officially begins can mean the difference between getting a good instructor and one who shouldn't be allowed to hold lectures in front of rocks. For real.  Make use of the resources of being a TA to see which instructors you want. This is why you need the updated class schedule list early-- you CAN pick and choose instructors if you are aggressive.  Admissions and student affairs will actively obstruct you however. That's why you have to be dilligent and dogged about it. If you are gonna pay for it, get your money's worth.

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Xvareon

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2014, 08:42:04 pm »

Thanks, guys. I've started College now, and while it was somewhat stressful to deal with everything, I've taken care of pretty much all the core paperwork and registration issues, now. It was a hell of a lot easier than I thought it was gonna be. The financial aid I got will last me for two full semesters per year, and a little for the third one as well. It should be well within my means.

I can't really tell if I'm excited or no, because of the headache and all, but... now that I can tell up from down and left from right in this college system, I feel a lot more confident that I can make it work. The teachers/instructors I got saddled with are great, too; they're the type who'll bend over backwards to help their students, so I have the best advantage possible, there. The students also seem to have their heads on right, with nary a troublesome one in sight. I just have to pull my weight and do the best job I can, and I should be able to come out of this with straight A's. I feel a lot more confident that I'm on the right path now that I'm starting to settle in. ^^

LeoLeonardoIII

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2014, 06:43:26 pm »

Awesome, good luck!
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nenjin

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Re: Going to College soon, need help on some core concepts
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2014, 07:02:42 pm »

Party hard, study harder!
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