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Author Topic: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting  (Read 906 times)

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Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« on: July 05, 2013, 04:13:21 pm »

So I've got an unpowered magma minecart loader nearly up and running, but I'm having a problem I hope y'all can help with.

The concept of this loader is to avoid the problem of magma viscosity ruining impulse ramps, by running the track through two chambers: the upper chamber, which is filled with magma; and the lower chamber, which drains magma to the edge of the map. The chambers are separated by a retracting bridge, which is linked to a minecart-triggered pressure plate.

\
X\
XX\  ^_X
XXXXX\                  /
XXXXXX\  drain  /////X
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

The minecart enters the magma chamber, triggers the pressure plate, and stops on the bridge. Magma fills the minecart during the trigger delay, and when the bridge retracts, it falls down onto the track slope beneath, whence the magma drains off the map and the minecart is free to resume open air physics.

Here's the problem: the bridge doesn't automatically close. It stays open until I send another minecart through, which, since I'm still in the prototyping phase/using dwarfpower to load the route, isn't until after the magma has already mostly evaporated.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this behavior? This is my first experiment involving magma automation or liquid minecart loading, so I'm afraid I may be in over my head a little.
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Snaake

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Re: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2013, 05:18:32 pm »

So I've got an unpowered magma minecart loader nearly up and running, but I'm having a problem I hope y'all can help with.

The concept of this loader is to avoid the problem of magma viscosity ruining impulse ramps, by running the track through two chambers: the upper chamber, which is filled with magma; and the lower chamber, which drains magma to the edge of the map. The chambers are separated by a retracting bridge, which is linked to a minecart-triggered pressure plate.

\
X\
XX\  ^_X
XXXXX\                  /
XXXXXX\  drain  /////X
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

The minecart enters the magma chamber, triggers the pressure plate, and stops on the bridge. Magma fills the minecart during the trigger delay, and when the bridge retracts, it falls down onto the track slope beneath, whence the magma drains off the map and the minecart is free to resume open air physics.

Here's the problem: the bridge doesn't automatically close. It stays open until I send another minecart through, which, since I'm still in the prototyping phase/using dwarfpower to load the route, isn't until after the magma has already mostly evaporated.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this behavior? This is my first experiment involving magma automation or liquid minecart loading, so I'm afraid I may be in over my head a little.

Hey awesome, you almost read my mind. Been getting back to DF again a bit, and one of the things I've been thinking about is how to most easily load up magma carts (transferring power that deep is hard, and wasn't sure if impulse ramps would work. Or rollers either, actually). This seems like a very promising option.

I was going to suggest that you set the plate to 2/7 magma (I'm pretty noob at pressure plates, triggers and timers), but then I reread your text and noticed you have it triggering off the cart, I guess?...

Anyway, here's a suggestion for a modified version: Switch the pressure plate you have to open the bridge when at 2/7 magma or more (magma spreads out just as rapidly as water to 1/7 if it has room or can drain, right?). The magma will drain down the same bridge that the cart goes, once it opens. Or you can have it drain to the area before the pressure plate too, if you want (if you have 2 tiles, have a 1-tile retracting bridge drain just to the left of your existing pressure plate, and a 1/7 magma-triggered pressure plate to the left of that) And set another pressure plate a bit earlier on the route that signals your pump/some bridge system/whatever to input magma to the tile that the cart stops in. Main problem I foresee is if all the magma doesn't evaporate before your cart/the next cart comes down again (which might cause the cart to fall into the first drainage, or just zoom through without loading), but I guess you can always set the 1/7 plate to also prevent access to this part of the system before it's dry.
Code: [Select]
A
X\
XX\
XXX\BdC_X
XXXXXXX\           /
XXXXXXXX\ddddd/////X
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
(btw, I like to use the code tags or That Other Tag I Can't Remember Right Now to force equal-width characters )
the d are drain squares. The pressure plates are marked by the capital letters: A is triggered by the cart and pumps magma onto the middle level, B is triggered by 1/7 magma and keeps the d-square next to it open, and C is triggered by the cart to open up the bridge on it's right. You may have to fiddle with the placement of A to get the timing right, i.e. that the cart has time to fill up after traveling over c, but B doesn't have time to trigger. Not sure if this system would even need the lowest level, unless the idea is to have grates on those squares and rely on the 2 downwards ramps giving the cart enough speed to derail all the way to the impulse ramps?
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Re: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2013, 08:42:30 am »

By the way, I solved my problem/it's working fine now by placing another pressure plate further along the track, linked to the same bridge. Apparently if a pressure plate de-presses before the bridge fires, it doesn't ever send the "close" signal to the bridge. Silly tick delays.
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OcelotTango

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Re: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2013, 09:07:15 am »

Hatches and doors don't have a delay with mechanics like bridges and floodgates do, that might help.
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Re: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2013, 11:27:29 am »

Hatches and doors don't have a delay with mechanics like bridges and floodgates do, that might help.

I tried a door earlier, but since doors need a level floor for placement, once the door stopped the minecart it couldn't get up the momentum it needed to get through the door, given magma viscosity.

If a minecart were on a hatch when it opened, wouldn't it flip the minecart or something?
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Sutremaine

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Re: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2013, 04:47:59 pm »

Hatches drop objects or creatures straight down, unlike bridges.

one of the things I've been thinking about is how to most easily load up magma carts (transferring power that deep is hard
Why not build a water reactor on-site?
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Re: Magma/Minecart/Pressure Plate/Bridge Complex Not Resetting
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2013, 12:15:38 am »

Hatches drop objects or creatures straight down, unlike bridges.

one of the things I've been thinking about is how to most easily load up magma carts (transferring power that deep is hard
Why not build a water reactor on-site?

You mean raisin bridges. Retracting ones don't toss stuff around, do they? Or did I just learn something new?

I'd rather not build a water reactor due to fps. Then again, it wouldn't have to run all the time so maybe. But if I'm going to use something as exploity as a perpetual motion machine exploit, why not just go straight to the simpler-to-build one? Which is both an argument for and against, I suppose: against water reactors because an exploit is an exploit, and impulse ramps are just easier, and for since the extra effort in the water reactor and (magma-safe) rollers make it less of an exploit.
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