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[Pearnamer]

I just started the game and have lost my first half-dozen citadels- starvation, dehydration, massive flooding.. You know, the usual issues.

I'm trying to build an underground well (or rather a huge, deep cistern that I can put a well over), and I've run into some problems with floodgates- clearly, I'm doing it wrong.

1) Basically, when I build a choke-point in a tunnel for putting in a floodgate, once I put the floodgate in, I can't get the @#*& miner dwarf to cross the floodgate, and make the connecting tunnel segment.  I've tried connecting the (dry) floodgate to a lever, and having someone flip the lever, but this doesn't seem to change the dwarf's ability to get there (so maybe I did that wrong too).

An illustration may help explain my issue:

F=Floodgate, L=Lever, .=Open Space(falls 7 levels), X=Wall, +=Floor, ~=Water

code:

~XXXXXXXX
~XF+++..+  <-- miner comes from here
~XXXXXL++   
     XXXX 

I'd really like to dig out that last wall segment between the floodgate and the river (yes, I know, double-floodgates is much safer, but for the moment, I'm just trying to get the thing working at all!) but regardless of how many times I've flipped the lever, the miner refuses to path to the marked brick.  (I've actually got grates over the pit, and verified that he can still reach the tunnel, because he'll go in and mine the sides of it)

I assume I have to put in the floodgate BEFORE I flood the tunnel (I lost a couple of citadels trying that in the other order).  I *think* I connected the lever to the floodgate properly.  If it matters, this is one level below ground, tapping the bottom of a surface stream.

2) Is there some trick here, which I missed?

[ February 24, 2008: Message edited by: Pearnamer ]

[Tanelorn]

If the floodgate is connected to the lever properly, then you should be able to open the floodgate and get the dwarf to dig out the remaining wall to let the water in.

To check if it is connect to the lever, you can press "t" and position the cursor on the floodgate (and it will say mechanisms if it is connected). Put that wont guarantee that the lever is connected too.

So you are better off adding a queue of orders to the lever : 1) Connect to floodgate and 2)Pull lever. When choosing the floodgate to connect to, make sure you use + and - to choose the right floodgate (if you have more than one in your fortress). Scrolling won't work.

By the way, you should keep your lever somewhere else. The way it is, it will eventually be submerged when your cistern fills up. Put in on a higher z-level so it won't happen and you can close the floodgate should you need to. It's a simple precaution in case you dig into you cistern by accident. At least you will be able to stop the water supply. The cistern will empty out and that's the end of it.

[ChaosFollowing]

Also, water can move through floodgates. Dwarves cannot.

[Tanelorn]

Dwarves can move through open floodgate. Mine to it all the time.
They have a tendency to block their escape when they place a floodgate, and I need to connect the gate and open it to let them out. They use the open floodgate as a door - no problem crossing it.

[Pearnamer]

Thanks, you gave me the hint I needed!

For anyone as clueless as me who hits this in the future via the search feature:
When a floodgate is open, it looks like it's not there.  You'll know that you've hooked it up correctly, because you can change it to appear like that.

To hook it up correctly, you (q) building manage your lever.
Hook it up to a (f)loodgate.
Select your floodgate from the list (as Tanelorn said, must use the -+ to get to it)
Select the first mechanism you're going to use (created at a Mechanic's Workshop)
Select the SECOND mechanism you're going to use. (note, that neither of these, which you select from a list, is either the lever or the floodgate)
As an added bit of sanity, queue up a second job on the lever, and ask for someone to (P)ull it.  This shows you that you connected the right lever to the right floodgate (mostly, because it disappears).  Use (t) to inspect the floodgate for connectiveness.

As for me and my cistern, I'm trying a pressure switch to open/close a second floodgate, on a "shelf" one floor down from my main floor.  With luck, I won't be shortly starting citadel nine this week.

For what it's worth, it took my Mechanic a very long time to do the connection- I don't know if it's related to having turned off Architect job role on him (he didn't connect stuff until I removed that role, temporarily).

Sadly, it took so freaking long to get everything in place, that all the water froze before I could bring some underground, and I've probably got a couple of weeks before everyone dies of dehydration again.  I'll get it next time.

[ February 24, 2008: Message edited by: Pearnamer ]

[Untelligent]

O_o Dwarves can't move through open floodgates? I didn't know that...

[Tanelorn]

Yes can move through open floodgates. An open  floodgate is essentially a corridor. The floodgate is not displayed anymore, making it hard at times to know if there is a floodgate at all.

[DonerKebab]

Yes its messed up that dwarves pretty much always trap themselves on the wrong side of a floodgate.  Actually the easiest (and possibly least elegant) way to build a well is to have a double width corridor with a channel on one side leading to open space below.  Piercing the wall to the water will allow the water to drain to the level below and the dwarves to escape at the same time.  Or, if you're piercing the wall on a level below the channel, a simple door will allow them to escape in time and block the water inflow to the rest of fort.  Do forbid the door though once your miner gets out...

[Troas]

You can also solve this problem by using a temporary door.  I'd hit a vein of ore while digging the magma channel for my smelters and forge and I was having a problem with dwarves being stupid about standing on the wrong side of it when rewalling.  So I built a door on the side where the dwarf insisted on standing and set it to forbidden.  This made the dwarf stand on the correct side when making the rewall.  If you are using this to force them to stand on the proper side of a floodgate remove the door after you link and open the floodgate.

Also be sure there are no unsealed openings below your water source level.  Otherwise you will probably wind up flooding your fortress.  I wound up building a well 1 z level below my river source, and wound up with a mess on the lower halls before a dwarf threw the cutoff lever.  Luckily I hadn't made a U bend so the flood wasn't infinite.