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[Twangykid]

I would like to dam a river temporarily while i set up floodgates, so i can turn the waterfall on and off. (Gotta save the occasional useful dwarf from the fall). Is there anyway to do this? Preferably without pumps as i find them rather difficult to use. I was thinking of dropping stones in to block it. Also, would the river overflow when blocked?

[Nil Eyeglazed]

Can't do it with controlled cave-in-- constructed walls will just deconstruct, rather than make new walls.  You can do it with freezing, if your map allows.

Otherwise, pumps.  Sorry.  Gotta figure them out sometime anyhow.

EDIT: Or, one other option.  Build an alternate channel that you can block off, that runs offscreen, maybe through the caverns, maybe through fortifications, and when it's ready, divert the river through that.  That gives you enough breathing room to build a dam.

[Uronym]

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Dam

That explains a lot of ways. And don't be afraid of pumps, they're actually not so bad once you get to knowing them.

[Twangykid]

WELP. Both my miners walked into the waterfall, along with my only picks and legendary engraver. The entire river was restricted and their was a perfectly safe tunnel under the waterfall, but nope, they have to walk off. This was early in the world as well, so no making more picks, time to abandon-reclaim. :L is there anyway to force them to NOT walk through it? I know the mist is pretty and all, but if you complain one more time that you are hurt, and my engraver takes it upon himself to rescue your sorry asses, i am taking away the booze stockpile. Forever.

[krenshala]

WELP. Both my miners walked into the waterfall, along with my only picks and legendary engraver. The entire river was restricted and their was a perfectly safe tunnel under the waterfall, but nope, they have to walk off. This was early in the world as well, so no making more picks, time to abandon-reclaim. :L is there anyway to force them to NOT walk through it? I know the mist is pretty and all, but if you complain one more time that you are hurt, and my engraver takes it upon himself to rescue your sorry asses, i am taking away the booze stockpile. Forever.

You say you had a tunnel, and had marked the falls as restricted.  Did you mark the tunnel as a high traffic area?  Was the tunnel far away from the falls?  Normal tiles have a value of 2 for pathfinding.  High traffic is 1, restricted is, iirc, 25.  Which path a dwarf takes is the one with the lower total value.  Sometimes restricted tiles isn't enough because the "good" path is still a higher value (thus it is considered less desirable).  Also, if they had picked the path before you marked the falls as restricted they won't repath when you mark them.

[rtg593]

WELP. Both my miners walked into the waterfall, along with my only picks and legendary engraver. The entire river was restricted and their was a perfectly safe tunnel under the waterfall, but nope, they have to walk off. This was early in the world as well, so no making more picks, time to abandon-reclaim. :L is there anyway to force them to NOT walk through it? I know the mist is pretty and all, but if you complain one more time that you are hurt, and my engraver takes it upon himself to rescue your sorry asses, i am taking away the booze stockpile. Forever.

You say you had a tunnel, and had marked the falls as restricted.  Did you mark the tunnel as a high traffic area?  Was the tunnel far away from the falls?  Normal tiles have a value of 2 for pathfinding.  High traffic is 1, restricted is, iirc, 25.  Which path a dwarf takes is the one with the lower total value.  Sometimes restricted tiles isn't enough because the "good" path is still a higher value (thus it is considered less desirable).  Also, if they had picked the path before you marked the falls as restricted they won't repath when you mark them.

This. If your waterfall is, say, 3 restricted tiles wide, that costs 75 pathfinding points to cross. If it takes 38 normal tiles to reach the same spot, they take the restricted path. Set the desired to high traffic, and you would need 76 tiles to make it less desirable.

Also, wall off the end off the falls, the low water tricks them into thinking it's safe.

[Girlinhat]

(Didn't read the whole thread.)
My preferred method is to divert, actually.  Down.  Dig under the river, towards the map's edge.  Just a short spurt, or longer if you want to install water wheels.  Then go down to the the stone layer and dig to the map's edge.  Once that's done, smooth the edge all and carve fortifications.  Now, water will drain off the map!  I usually make my drainage tunnel 2 deep for safety, and place a paved road inside to prevent trees.

Once you have the drainage set up, build a scaffolding above the river and cave it in.  If done right, you'll punch a hole through the river bottom, the constructed walls will disappear, and the river will divert underground.  Now place cage traps all along the dry riverbed, and shut the floodgates.  You did instal floodgates in the tunnel to block flow, right?  Once the gates are closed, the river will resume as usual, with a small area underneath containing water up to the floodgates.

Works very well, reusable in case you want to divert again, and can selectively power your waterwheels in the drainage tunnels if you're into that sort of thing.  Additionally, if you've got an underground fort, you can divert the river through your dining hall, utilizing pressure equalizers, to have mist generators while the river is diverted.  Or if you fail to use equalizers, drowning chambers!  Both will affect civilian morale!

[Lielac]

Spoiler: I TAKE BACK SAYING THIS WOULD BE EASY. Fixed numbers on the screw pump materials, will let this sit for a while while I try to figure out how to prevent this from flooding the universe. Possibly involving bridges and the edge of the map... (click to show/hide)

Assuming you have a 4-wide river as in the image, you'll need (this can all be bought on embark):
A carpenter
A mechanic
An architect
A mason if using stone in anything other than the mechanisms
25/26/27 logs for:
* 1/2/3 for:
** Mechanic's workshop; can be replaced with stone and/or torn down when no longer needed
** Carpenter's workshop; can be replaced with stone and/or torn down when no longer needed
** (Optional) Mason's workshop; can be replaced with stone and/or torn down when no longer needed
* 8 for a floor where the pumps go so you can build them; can be replaced with stone
* 12 for:
** 4 pipe sections
** 4 enormous corkscrews
** 4 wooden blocks; can be replaced with stone
* 3 for the waterwheel
* 1 for the east-west horizontal axle
2 stone for mechanisms
If you are replacing the blocks, take another log/stone for a mason's workshop. You can reduce the total logs needed to 22 if you tear down the carpenter's/mechanic's workshop to use its materials for the other, and this still holds true if you replace things with stone versions and build a mason's workshop at some point.

To build the contraption, place the right gear, the horizontal axle, and the floor. Don't span the floor over the whole river but instead make it 1 less than needed to go over the whole thing, otherwise the dwarves will take a swim. Once most of the floor has been completed place its last tiles, and also make the waterwheel if the right gear has been built yet. The pumps (pumping so the passable tile is closer to the waterfall) can be added in as each tile for them is added. Once everything else has been completed, build the left gear to start the whole thing going. ‼Science‼! You should now have a dammed river!

The whole setup will generate 100 power and requires 62. It doesn't have to be that exact distance from the edge of the fall and can be made farther or closer if you want, as well as mirrored vertically if the dwarves are south of the river and/or horizontally if the waterfall is in the east, or rotated... basically it's not stuck like how you see it. It can be used to dam up to a 7-tile river with basic addition of pumps; you just need 5 logs for each tile of the river. For a 8 or wider river, you'll need another water wheel. That should be extrapolatable from the image and the knowledge that a water wheel generates 100 and needs 10, and that the gear assembly/axle portion needs 12 power. You should also bring extra flooring tiles if the river is wider than 7 tiles so you can build the farther-out water wheels. I can answer any questions for wide rivers.

This can also be modified for use with a brook. You won't need the logs to build the floor for the pumps, and you'll need to channel out the area for the water wheel, but otherwise it's pretty much identical. The horizontal axle can also actually be just one tile and the waterwheel touching the top pump, but it's one power of difference and the power generator-transfer part would still not have enough juice left over to handle 8 pumps because power is only transferable from the middle tile of a water wheel.

Future-past reply to rtg593: I'll try that!

[rtg593]

Using pumps to dam a river isn't really that difficult, and is the most easily torn down once you don't need them anymore.

Spoiler: STUPID MISTAKE BY ME: Make walls to channel the water to ONLY flow into the river! I'll fix the image and text in a bit. (It does otherwise work!) (click to show/hide)

Assuming you have a 4-wide river as in the image, you'll need (this can all be bought on embark):
A carpenter
A mechanic
An architect
A mason if using stone in anything other than the mechanisms
22/23/24 logs for:
* 1/2/3 for:
** Mechanic's workshop; can be replaced with stone and/or torn down when no longer needed
** Carpenter's workshop; can be replaced with stone and/or torn down when no longer needed
** (Optional) Mason's workshop; can be replaced with stone and/or torn down when no longer needed
* 8 for a floor where the pumps go so you can build them; can be replaced with stone
* 9 for:
** 3 pipe sections
** 3 enormous corkscrews
** 3 wooden blocks; can be replaced with stone
* 3 for the waterwheel
* 1 for the 2-tile east-west horizontal axle
2 stone for mechanisms
If you are replacing anything with stone (except if it's just the floor), take another log/stone for a mason's workshop. You can reduce the total logs needed to 22 if you tear down the carpenter's/mechanic's workshop to use its materials for the other, and this still holds true if you replace things with stone versions and build a mason's workshop at some point.

To build the contraption, place the right gear, the horizontal axle, and the floor. Don't span the floor over the whole river but instead make it 1 less than needed to go over the whole thing, otherwise the dwarves will take a swim. Once most of the floor has been completed place its last tiles, and also make the waterwheel if the right gear has been built yet. The pumps (pumping so the passable tile is closer to the waterfall) can be added in as each tile for them is added. Once everything else has been completed, build the left gear to start the whole thing going. ‼Science‼! You should now have a dammed river!

The whole setup will generate 100 power and requires 62. It doesn't have to be that exact distance from the edge of the fall and can be made farther or closer if you want, as well as mirrored vertically if the dwarves are south of the river and/or horizontally if the waterfall is in the east, or rotated... basically it's not stuck like how you see it. It can be used to dam up to a 7-tile river with basic addition of pumps; you just need 5 logs for each tile of the river. For a 8 or wider river, you'll need another water wheel. That should be extrapolatable from the image and the knowledge that a water wheel generates 100 and needs 10, and that the gear assembly/axle portion needs 12 power. You should also bring extra flooring tiles if the river is wider than 7 tiles so you can build the farther-out water wheels. I can answer any questions for wide rivers.

This can also be modified for use with a brook. You won't need the logs to build the floor for the pumps, and you'll need to channel out the area for the water wheel, but otherwise it's pretty much identical. The horizontal axle can also actually be just one tile and the waterwheel touching the top pump, but it's one power of difference and the power generator-transfer part would still not have enough juice left over to handle 8 pumps because power is only transferable from the middle tile of a water wheel.

You could also loop a channel out around the pump area and back in, that would eliminate the 2 gears and save 11 power by placing the water wheel beside the pump one axel out. The extra water flow won't cause job cancellations, and you can place a floodgates before the waterwheel, and link it to your dams gates, and still have a fully functional floodgates dam. Just built with more efficient power use:p can do a 8 tile wide river with that set up.

[Lielac]

Proper @rtg593: I'll try doing that.

Anyone have tips for where to divert the excess water, since it's just piling up on the 7-deep water it's being pumped on to and causing unexpected ‼fun‼? I'm thinking putting this contraption near the edge of the map and using bridges to keep it contained until it flows off the map... also a lever. That would require the river to be straight enough there to build it...

[ItchyBeard]

Proper @rtg593: I'll try doing that.

Anyone have tips for where to divert the excess water, since it's just piling up on the 7-deep water it's being pumped on to and causing unexpected ‼fun‼? I'm thinking putting this contraption near the edge of the map and using bridges to keep it contained until it flows off the map... also a lever. That would require the river to be straight enough there to build it...

If you want to be cheap, you can use a large drawbridge or a lot of floodgates/doors to destroy the water entirely (when hooked up to a repeating lever).

Digging down to the caverns and dumping the water there also works. It will eventually make its way off the edge of the cavern (or make a few new lakes).

[Lielac]

Proper @rtg593: I'll try doing that.

Anyone have tips for where to divert the excess water, since it's just piling up on the 7-deep water it's being pumped on to and causing unexpected ‼fun‼? I'm thinking putting this contraption near the edge of the map and using bridges to keep it contained until it flows off the map... also a lever. That would require the river to be straight enough there to build it...

If you want to be cheap, you can use a large drawbridge or a lot of floodgates/doors to destroy the water entirely (when hooked up to a repeating lever).

Digging down to the caverns and dumping the water there also works. It will eventually make its way off the edge of the cavern (or make a few new lakes).

I think I'll try the atomsmashing way next time.

This time, I made this thing:


As you can hopefully tell, that's most the river drained to 1 and 2 deep. Come to think I don't actually need that third bridge because there's a solid line of impassable tiles made by the waterwheel and the pumps, but m'eh. This setup would drain almost the whole river, because the left side is right up against the map. It is... also kind of silly. I'm going to keep it in my file of things I could use, though, because you never know when you'll want to drain the river.

Warning: this is a picture of the river at 1s and 2s because this is a partial of the last frame from this particular fort. Near the end of late Spring DF puked up an error message and had to close.