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Author Topic: Starbound - We have lift off.  (Read 944917 times)

Sean Mirrsen

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2235 on: August 05, 2013, 02:25:12 pm »

Conspiracy, what conspiracy? I'm not talking about a conspiracy. I'm talking about the fact that there are things in this world that use flaming zombie dinosaurs to propel hundreds of sharp metal blades with enough force to destroy entire forests... and a lot of people are keeping one of those things in their garden shed.
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GlyphGryph

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2236 on: August 05, 2013, 02:27:23 pm »

Also, do YOU actually know what a conspiracy is, Neonivek...?

The way you are talking about it is... weird.
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Chattox

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2237 on: August 05, 2013, 02:34:41 pm »

Also, do YOU actually know what a conspiracy is, Neonivek...?

The way you are talking about it is... weird.

It's obviously a conspiracy.
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quinnr

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2238 on: August 05, 2013, 02:38:16 pm »

Nobody in this thread has even claimed to be creating conspiracy theories, as far as I can see. Maybe you are thinking this is the conspiracy giveaway thread? :S
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Myroc

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2239 on: August 05, 2013, 02:51:20 pm »

And that post isn't a parody of the HL3 confirmed stuff? It's genuinely serious?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_Law
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Sergius

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2240 on: August 05, 2013, 04:32:38 pm »

AFAIK thatis a thing in Star Trek Online and LotRO.

....seriously?

Well STO at least uses ingame money, basically fast travel to your active quest start (and you get a free teleport to your home planet or clan base each hour or so, which is plenty. And distances aren't really big). But LotRO has in the Cash Shop some sort of travel tokens that you need to fast travel to any town or somesuch, otherwise, be prepared to walk a lot (I think you also get a free teleport to your home city every hour or so, can't remember).

Now back to scheduled topic: Starbound.
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GrayFox

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2241 on: August 05, 2013, 06:09:40 pm »

I think they've said in the past that they know their development processes and priorities are a bit different than usual.
I guess we're now really finding out the roadblocks in their methods.  :-\
« Last Edit: August 05, 2013, 07:12:05 pm by GrayFox »
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Skyrunner

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2242 on: August 05, 2013, 07:10:50 pm »

I think they've said in the past that they know their development processes and priorities are a bit different than usual. I guess we're now really finding out the roadblocks in their methods.  :-\
It's an experiment on programming methodologies! For (computer) science!
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Chattox

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2243 on: August 06, 2013, 03:19:21 am »

I think they've said in the past that they know their development processes and priorities are a bit different than usual. I guess we're now really finding out the roadblocks in their methods.  :-\
It's an experiment on programming methodologies! For (computer) science!

That's all well and good, but they could at least experiment on a less interesting and highly anticipated game :P
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The setting of Half-Life 2 Episode 3's release: "It is the 41st Millennium. For more than a hundred centuries the Gabe has sat immobile on the..."

Darkmere

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2244 on: August 06, 2013, 03:34:55 am »

Yeah, it sounds less like "experimentation" to me and more like completely taking a finished house apart and moving it directly across the street, then reassembling it and hoping you didn't lose even a single screw or nail.

Somewhere, there is a lost nail that will be the doom of us all. DOOOOM!
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And then, they will be weaponized. Like everything in this game, from kittens to babies, everything is a potential device of murder.
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Knight of Fools

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2245 on: August 06, 2013, 04:10:56 am »

I'm pretty sure it's well established in programming that you want to do things one thing at a time. First you build the foundation, test it, make sure it's solid, and then you build the next most important part. Once that's working properly, you move on from there and so on.

In a recent video, Extra Credits gives some advice about being an indie game dev, and one of the points boils down to not working on new content all of the time. It feels like you're getting stuff done, but in reality you're just making a huge mess to clean up later on.

Some of that mess won't be a simple cleanup. It's spread throughout the development process, so entire mechanics may be clunky or even incongruous with the rest of the game. You go from feeling like you're getting huge chunks of things done (When you're really just building on a shaky foundation) to having to fine tune a massive amount of crap (Which is demoralizing and a good portion of which could have been avoided completely). Prefabrication isn't something that works well in programming, because code can't be shaped into perfect puzzle pieces every time.


We don't know what exactly is going on, but the entire process seems short sighted looking in on it from the outside. For all we know, they're onto something and they know exactly what they're doing. The only way we'll know is from the final product or postmortems from the developers.
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mendonca

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2246 on: August 06, 2013, 04:47:06 am »

Should probably post to watch this, rather than manually having to search the topic out every few days.
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Dakorma

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2247 on: August 06, 2013, 04:47:52 am »

Guys, they are changing compilers because MINGW's C compiler is getting weird and scary in places, as well as being less optimized for Windows in general. They've also likely been on the compiler they used at the start of development, which was 2 years ago IIRC. It's pretty necessary, and honestly not that big of a deal.

It's not changing the house, it's more like changing the locks.

More than that, your assumptions on hemmingjay's words are rather impressive. Ranging from assuming they have multiple codebases(Something that a large variety of games do/did have.) To those code bases being utterly unable to work together.

What they are doing in programming terms is object oriented design in it's purest form. As far as I can tell, they have all the feature sets there, they just are trying to make them interact. Depending on their setup and the tools they have, this ranges from mildly tedious, to "Oh I'm done."

Essentially they have the code for the GUI set up, and the code for the crafting set up, so that neither requires the other to run, which is excellent use of object oriented programming. Now what they need to do is have the code interact with each other, so the GUI can display crafting, crafting can plug stuff into the gui, etc. Given their previous progress and fast implementation, this game should be out before thanksgiving at the latest.

The other option is that Hemmingjay completely misunderstood his "contact," and they are talking about the standard issue of gameplay in games like this. Which is that everything feels mostly disconnected, and making all these systems work together could be difficult.

How to make it so that the player has incentive to compose ballads using their music system. Or complete quests, when the quests probably don't reward you with anything of note, because by the very nature of games like this everything is craftable. How to make it so that combat is rewarding while still being in line with all of the other features. These are all rhetorical and I'm not expecting answers to them, they are mostly examples of the issues that come up in game design. Games like this are not easy, because they have no real goal, other than what you set for yourself. They have a good core concept and that's that the game is a metroidvania styled game, with crafting and space travel. But how do they communicate that with the players. How do you make it so that all aspects of the game are rewarding. Minecraft's is easy because you've got no real goal, you just have blocks and infinite possibilities. The moment you introduce a goal or a story into the game you run into issues. How do you make the faffing about the genre relies on compensate for the need for tensity. Or to say it another simpler way, how do you make the narrative compensate for the poster collecting, or the going around to places erecting giant statues of your penis so the masses may be educated of it's glory? These are legitimate concerns that come up in games like this, where you have ample time to just sit around and think, "Who am I and why am I doing this?"

That right there is one of the main reasons why the elder scrolls games have felt inconsistent to me since Morrowind. In Daggerfall you needed political capital, you needed a reputation, to even think about succeeding at preventing the rebellion. In Morrowind the danger was much more present, but was again in the stages of building up forces, taking on an Empire and then the Gods themselves takes time after all. After that though it's a case of, " TAKE THIS AND USE IT TO CLOSE SHUT THE MAWS OF OBLIVION." "Nah I think I'll just faff about. Stop the rebellion in the mages, guild, destroy a rival drug trading fighters guild. See the Dark Brotherhood completely collapse. Restore the position of the COUNT OF MONTE BRAVIL. You know that kinda stuff." There's too much going on, too fast, and it just all loses meaning. Especially when you have that crucial time to go "Who am I, what am I doing and why." The game loses all sorts of meaning, if you have anticipation, a strong plot, a fast guiding strand of main plot, and then you lose the players completely by just letting them do whatever they want.

Imagine how tense Oblivion would have been if they kept your focus on the main plot. Instead of leading you around with dozens of side quests and ancilliary plots all while, "QUICKLY YOU MUST SHUT CLOSE THE JAWS OF OBLIVION"

That was a tangent but I really felt I couldn't explain it well without a hyperbolic explanation like that. Oblivion is probably one of the worse examples I could have used. But it does bring up a good point. Sandbox games don't work unless there's a reason behind all the faffing about, if there's any sense of urgency at all.
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Tiruin

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2248 on: August 06, 2013, 05:15:00 am »

PTW because of a nice gift I've gotten in relation with this thread.
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Sarzael

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2249 on: August 06, 2013, 09:47:12 am »

PTW because of a nice gift I've gotten in relation with this thread.
What?
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